Michigan Department of Education Meeting for November 18, 2014 – Afternoon Session


>>CALL OUR MEETING BACK TO ORDER, AND I DON’T– EXCUSE ME FOR MY MIX-UP FOR A MOMENT. SO, GOOD AFTERNOON. THE TIME IS NOW 1:39, AND A QUORUM OF THE BOARD IS PRESENT. THE STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION MEETING OF NOVEMBER 18 IS HEREBY CALLED TO ORDER. WE’RE GOING TO GO STRAIGHT TO PUBLIC PARTICIPATION. MERTZ.>>WE ARE ALLOWING THREE MINUTES FOR PUBLIC COMMENT TODAY, AND I JUST WANT TO REMIND SPEAKERS, OR LET YOU KNOW FOR THE FIRST TIME, THAT THE BOARD IS HAPPY TO HEAR WHATEVER YOU HAVE TO SAY. IF YOU HAVE WRITTEN MATERIALS, YOU CAN PASS THEM TO THE PERSON AT THE TABLE WHO’S CLOSEST TO YOU, AND THEY’RE HAPPY TO SHARE THEM AROUND THE TABLE FOR YOU. WE’LL JUST PASS THEM ALONG. THE BOARD DOES NOT ENGAGE IN A CONVERSATION, QUESTION AND ANSWER TYPE THING. SO OUR FIRST SPEAKERS ARE COMING UP AS A GROUP OF THREE. THEY ARE STEVEN McGHEE, GEORGE SEAHORN, AND LESLIE FANTROY. RIGHT THERE. SO I’LL START THE TIMER WHENEVER YOU’RE READY.>>I’M READY. GOOD AFTERNOON. MY NAME IS STEVEN McGHEE, AND I’M THE PRINCIPAL AT CENTRAL COLLEGIATE ACADEMY, AN EDUCATION ACHIEVEMENT AUTHORITY SCHOOL. I’VE BEEN THERE FOR THE LAST FIVE YEARS. WHEN I FIRST CAME TO CENTRAL HIGH SCHOOL, SINCE 1858, ACTUALLY, THAT THE GRADUATION RATE WAS 52%, THE DROPOUT RATE WAS 48%, AND THE COMPOSITE ACT SCORE WAS 11.38. AS WE STAND, THE GRADUATION RATE IS 79.8%, AND THE DROPOUT RATE IS 14.9%. THE COMPOSITE ACT SCORE IS 14.98. YOU SAY, “IN GOD WE TRUST. ALL OTHERS, BRING DATA.” IN ADDITION TO THAT, CENTRAL IS NO LONGER A PART OF THE PLA IN TERMS OF THE BOTTOM 5%. WE GOT OFFICIAL NOTICE THIS SUMMER FROM THE DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION THAT WE’VE BEEN REMOVED FROM THAT BOTTOM 5%, SO WE ARE– [ APPLAUSE ] MOVING IN A CONGRUENT DIRECTION. ALSO, UNDER EXCELLENT SCHOOLS OF DETROIT, YOU KNOW THEY HAVE A COLOR CODING IN HOW THEY MEASURE SCHOOLS. WELL, WE RECEIVED THE GREEN– ORGANIZED FOR SUCCESS. SO WE’VE HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO MOVE FORWARD IN A POSITIVE DIRECTION. WE HAVE A UNIQUE MIX AT CENTRAL. WHEN I SAY THAT, WE’VE BROUGHT THEORISTS AND PRACTITIONERS TOGETHER. THE THEORISTS, FROM A STANDPOINT OF ELEVATING EDUCATIONAL OPPORTUNITIES FOR OUR CHILDREN. WE HAVE A CREDIT UNION IN OUR SCHOOL FOR FINANCIAL ISSUES. EVERY STUDENT HAS, AND IS WORKING ON HAVING, A CHECKING AND SAVINGS ACCOUNT, PUSHING AND PULL OUT FINANCIAL LITERACY, AND THAT’S DMCU, DIVERSIFIED METROPOLITAN CREDIT UNION. WE ALSO HAVE A PARTNERSHIP WITH ST. JOHN’S, WHERE YOU HAVE A NURSE AND A PRACTITIONER AND A PSYCHOLOGIST ON BOARD EVERY SINGLE DAY. WE’RE CEMENTING A PARTNERSHIP WITH PAPA JOHN’S, FOR BMF– BUSINESS, MANAGEMENT, MARKETING, AND FINANCE. EVERY STUDENT WILL LEARN HOW TO WRITE A BUSINESS PLAN AND A MARKETING PLAN AND A FINANCE PLAN. AND THEY WILL PUT IT INTO PLAY EVERY SINGLE DAY WITHIN THAT PIZZA CAFE. SO IF YOU’RE GOING 30-DAY, 60-DAY, 90-DAY STINTS AND 120. AND JUST LIKE YOU’RE IN THE REAL WORLD, IF YOU’RE SUCCESSFUL, YOU HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO GO FURTHER. [ INAUDIBLE ] — THE STUDENT’S SCHOLARSHIP LINE, AND A PORTION WILL GO BACK TO THE SCHOOL. WE’VE PRIDED OURSELF ON HAVING AN EDUCATIONAL CONSORTIUM WHERE WE HAVE 23 PARTNERS THAT ARE PHYSICALLY MOVED INTO THE SCHOOL. AND WE’VE ALIGNED OUR CURRICULUM WITH THOSE ENTITIES THAT ARE MOVED WITHIN THE SCHOOL, UNDER THE UMBRELLA OF STUDENT-CENTERED LEARNING. AND IT’S CALLED “LEARN, PRACTICE, APPLY, ASSESS.” SO AS YOU SAY, THE PROOF IS IN THE PUDDING. IN OTHER WORDS, I’D RATHER SEE A SERMON THAN HEAR ONE ANY DAY. AND ANY GIVEN TIME THAT YOU WANT TO COME AND VISIT, JUST WALK THROUGH THE DOORS AT 2425 TUXEDO, AND WE’LL WELCOME YOU. THANK YOU.>>THANK YOU, SIR.>>HELLO, EVERYONE. MY NAME IS LESLIE FANTROY. I ATTEND CENTRAL COLLEGIATE ACADEMY–>>THE BUZZER.>>KEEP– GO AHEAD. KEEP GOING.>>I ATTEND CENTRAL COLLEGIATE ACADEMY. MY STATUS IS A– 11th GRADE. I’M A JUNIOR. AND WELCOME TO– I’M SORRY. GOING INTO CENTRAL MY 9th GRADE YEAR, I HAD THE STUDENT PLATFORM FOR STUDENT LEARNING. AND IT WAS KIND OF HARD AND DIFFICULT FOR ME, STARTING OVER AT A DIFFERENT PLACE, BUT IN THAT ENVIRONMENT, I LEARNED DIFFERENT THINGS AND DIFFERENT MATERIALS, HOW TO TALK, AND HOW TO JUST OBEY MYSELF AND HAVE DISCIPLINE, ALL IN THAT ENVIRONMENT. SO RIGHT NOW, MY STATUS IS I’M TAKING COLLEGE COURSE CLASSES. I’M NOW PREPPING FOR MY ACT SCORES AND MY PERFORMANCE SERIES SCORES– SORRY. MY PERFORMANCE SERIES SCORES ARE NOW INCREASING. AT FIRST, I DID HAVE A LITTLE DECREASING, BUT NOW MY TEACHERS ARE TAKING ME TO A DIFFERENT LEVEL. I’M AT MY LEVEL CURRENTLY, MY 11th GRADE LEVEL. I’M READING AT MY 11th GRADE LEVEL, AND I’M PROUD OF IT AND I’M HAPPY, AND I CAN’T WAIT ‘TIL MY SENIOR YEAR, BECAUSE I HAVE EVERYTHING PLANNED OUT. [ APPLAUSE ]>>GOOD AFTERNOON. MY NAME IS GEORGE SEAHORN. I ATTEND CENTRAL COLLEGIATE ACADEMY AS WELL. MY STATUS IS I’M A SENIOR. DURING MY 9th GRADE YEAR, I ORIGINALLY WAS WITH DPS AT CENTRAL, SO WHEN 10th GRADE CAME, IT WAS KIND OF DIFFERENT. YOU KNOW, EAA HAD A NEW ENVIRONMENT FOR TEACHING, AND WHEN I FIRST ENCOUNTERED STUDENT-CENTERED LEARNING, IT WAS KIND OF TOUGH, AND I THOUGHT I WASN’T GOING TO MAKE IT. BUT I BEGAN TO LEARN, AND I BEGAN TO UNDERSTAND THAT IT’S TEACHING ME SELF-DISCIPLINE AS WELL AS TEACHING ME RESPONSIBILITY TO GET MY WORK DONE. IT’S UP TO ME TO GET IT DONE, AND I HAVE NO LIMIT, BUT WHATEVER YOU DECIDE IS HOW YOUR FUTURE IS GOING TO BECOME. AND HONESTLY, EVER SINCE EAA CAME AND I BEGAN STUDENT LEARNING, I’VE REALLY JOINED MANY ORGANIZATIONS, SUCH AS YOUNG MEN OF EXCELLENCE, SAFETY STATION, ROTC, POLICE EXPLORERS… AND THEY ALL HELPED ME GROW AND MOLDED ME INTO WHO I AM RIGHT NOW. AND I FEEL THAT ONCE I GRADUATE, I WANT TO COME BACK TO MY SCHOOL AS WELL AS OTHER EAA SCHOOLS AND SHARE MY EXPERIENCE OF WHAT I’VE BECOME IN THE FUTURE.>>THANK YOU. [ APPLAUSE ]>>THANK YOU ALL.>>THANK YOU VERY MUCH.>>OUR NEXT SPEAKER IS JOHN STEWART, FOLLOWED BY MARY STARR.>>AND FORMER REPRESENTATIVE STEWART, WE DO WANT YOU TO KNOW, WE TYPICALLY DON’T APPLAUD FOR ADULTS. THAT’S BECAUSE THE KIDS WERE HERE. [ LAUGHTER ] DON’T BE OFFENDED BY THAT. OKAY, YOUR TIME IS UP, SIR. [ LAUGHTER ]>>IT’S PART OF THE FIVE MINUTES.>>”HAVE PATIENCE, AND YOU’LL BE THE WINNER,” IS WHAT MY MOTHER TAUGHT ME. AND THERE ARE A LOT OF US IN THE PUBLIC ED COMMUNITY WHO ARE HAVING A TON OF PATIENCE. MY NAME IS JOHN STEWART. I’M AN ATTORNEY, STATE REPRESENTATIVE OF 6 YEARS, FORMER CHAIRMAN OF HIGHER EDUCATION APPROPRIATIONS. THIS BOARD IS THE ONLY PUBLIC FORUM FOR INTELLECTUAL HONESTY. THE PHI BETA KAPPAS ARE GONE FROM THE STATE CAPITAL. I’M REFERRING TO MY FRIEND, PAUL HILLEGONDS AND DAN DeGROW. FIRST, EDUCATIONAL POLICY SHOULD ONLY BE ESTABLISHED THROUGH RECOMMENDATIONS OF PROFESSIONALLY TRAINED TEACHERS AND FACULTY. PROFESSIONALLY TRAINED PUBLIC SCHOOL TEACHERS ARE THE BEST PEOPLE TO ESTABLISH EDUCATIONAL POLICY. SECOND, REGARDING CHARTERS: UNLESS THERE IS FULL DISCLOSURE AND A RESOLUTION FROM THIS BOARD SUPPORTING SARAH ROBERTS’S LEGISLATION, THERE’S GOING TO BE CORRUPTION. WE HAVE MORE THAN TWICE THE NUMBER OF CHARTERS THAN ANY OTHER STATE. THE 8-DAY SERIES IN THE CHARTER SCHOOLS AND “THE FREE PRESS” IS UNCONTROVERTED AND UNCONTESTED. HOW IS THE STATE BOARD GOING TO DEAL WITH THE CHARTER AND CYBER SCHOOLS AND THEIR CORRUPTION SCANDALS? WE KNEW, OR WE OUGHT TO HAVE KNOWN, OTHERWISE MIKE FLANAGAN AND I WOULD HAVE SAID NO THANK YOU TO THE McPHERSON REPORT ON MAY 1, 2002 THAT LIFTED THE CAP ON CHARTER SCHOOLS– THE ONLY THING GOVERNOR ENGLER DIDN’T GET IN HIS LAST YEAR IN OFFICE. THIRD, THE ISSUE OF THE EAA IS APPEARING TO BE, IN SOME POINT, A FAILED EXPERIMENT. A CLEAR MAJORITY OF FACULTY AT EASTERN MICHIGAN UNIVERSITY ARE AGAINST IT, AND 2 WEEKS FROM FRIDAY, THEY’RE GOING TO ASK TO SEVER THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN EASTERN MICHIGAN UNIVERSITY AND THE EAA. THERE’S A TAPE OUT THERE. THE BREAKING NEWS IS THAT IT’S VIRAL. CHIEF OF STAFF DENNIS MUCHMORE DROVE TO THE CHOP HOUSE AND HAD DINNER WITH TWO EMU REGENTS, AND WITHOUT ANY INPUT FROM FACULTY AT EASTERN MICHIGAN, ADOPTED A RELATIONSHIP. FOURTH, AND PURSUANT TO MY FRIEND, DR. MITCHELL ROBINSON, OF MICHIGAN STATE COLLEGE OF EDUCATION, THE SO-CALLED NEW TEACHER PROJECT, MICHIGAN TEACHER CORPS, TEACH FOR AMERICA, IS A TERRIBLE IDEA. THERE IS NO TEACHER SHORTAGE IN MICHIGAN. THIS IS A SLAP IN THE FACE AT THE PROFESSIONALLY TRAINED TEACHERS WHO HAVE COMPLETED A 5-YEAR EDUCATION AT ONE OF OUR NATIONALLY RANKED COLLEGES OF EDUCATION. I HAVE THE SUPPORT OF THOUSANDS OF TEACHERS WHICH I AM IN CONTACT WITH DAILY ALL ACROSS MICHIGAN: SOCIAL MEDIA GROUPS, MICHIGAN BATS– BAD-ASS TEACHERS ASSOCIATION, MICHIGAN TEACHER CONNECTION, MICHIGAN PARENTS FOR SCHOOLS, MICHIGAN PETITIONERS, AND SAVE MICHIGAN PUBLIC SCHOOLS. WHEN WE CHOOSE OUR NEW SUPERINTENDENT, WITH ALL RESPECT, WE NEED TO HAVE HIM OR HER WITH A TOUCH OF STEEL IN THEIR BACKBONE. THIS BOARD SHOULD BE A FORUM TO SUPPORT OUR CORE, TRADITIONAL PUBLIC SCHOOL SYSTEM. OUR PUBLIC SCHOOL TEACHERS DESERVE OUR SUPPORT AND APPRECIATION. PUBLIC EDUCATION IS NOT A PRIVATE SECTOR COMMODITY. PUBLIC EDUCATION IS A PUBLIC GOOD, A COMMON GOOD. I HOPE OUR GOVERNOR AND STATE LEGISLATORS WILL START TO SEE THIS. WE NEED TO RESTORE THE GREATNESS TO THE SYSTEM OF PUBLIC EDUCATION. MICHIGAN’S CHILDREN DESERVE THE BEST, AND WE’RE GOING TO GIVE THEM THE BEST. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.>>THANKS, JOHN.>>OUR NEXT SPEAKER IS MARY STARR, FOLLOWED BY DAVE KREBS.>>HI. I’M ALL SET.>>OKAY.>>HI, I’M MARY STARR. I’M EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF THE MICHIGAN MATHEMATICS AND SCIENCE CENTERS NETWORK. I REPRESENT 30 CENTERS THROUGHOUT THE STATE. WE ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE MATH AND SCIENCE PROFESSIONAL LEARNING EXPERIENCES FOR ALL OF MICHIGAN’S TEACHERS. THIS MORNING, ON MY WAY IN THE SNOW, I LISTENED TO THE LIVESTREAM OF YOUR MEETING AND THE PRESENTATION BY STEVE AND LINDA FORWARD OF THE NEW SCIENCE STANDARDS. SO I THANK YOU FOR YOUR STRONG SUPPORT AND THE PROBING QUESTIONS THAT YOU ASKED ABOUT HOW WE’RE GOING TO GO ABOUT IMPLEMENTING THE NEW STANDARDS IF THEY’RE TO BE ADOPTED. AND IN MY REMARKS, I’LL TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT SOME OF THE WAYS THE NETWORK WILL LOOK INTO THE ANSWERS TO THOSE QUESTIONS. FIRST OF ALL, I WANT TO POINT OUT THAT THE NEW STANDARDS ARE REALLY BASED ON RESEARCH. SO THE NEXT GEN SCIENCE STANDARDS AND THE FRAMEWORK FROM WHICH THEY WERE DRAWN ARE REALLY RESEARCH DOCUMENTS, AND I’VE BEEN LUCKY TO BE PART OF SOME OF THE RESEARCH TEAMS THAT HAVE BEEN ORGANIZED TO DO THAT WORK. THE MICHIGAN MATH AND SCIENCE CENTERS NETWORK IS AN EXTRAORDINARY RESOURCE FOR MICHIGAN TEACHERS. WE’RE IN A NETWORK THAT WE’RE ABLE TO THEN PROVIDE LEARNING EXPERIENCES AND A SHARED VISION OF WHAT SCIENCE LEARNING AND TEACHING CAN BE FOR ALL OF MICHIGAN’S STUDENTS. THIS MORNING, YOU ASKED SPECIFICALLY ABOUT ELEMENTARY SCHOOL TEACHERS. SO IN SOME OF THE WORK THAT WE’RE PUTTING TOGETHER, DRAWING NETWORK PARTNERS WHO ARE REALLY FOCUSED ON THE ISSUES OF ELEMENTARY SCHOOL TEACHERS. I WENT TO UNIVERSITY OF MICHIGAN DEARBORN AND WAS CERTIFIED AS AN ELEMENTARY TEACHER. SO I’M REALLY ACKNOWLEDGING THAT THERE ARE THOSE CONTENT AND PEDAGOGICAL ISSUES OF IMPLEMENTATION IN THE ELEMENTARY SCHOOL, SO WE’RE FOCUSED ON THAT AS A PRIORITY. WE’RE ALSO LOOKING TO WORK WITH NATIONAL PARTNERS. WE’RE HOPING TO ROLL OUT WORK WITH NGSX TEAM AS WELL AS THE NATIONAL SCIENCE TEACHERS ASSOCIATION AND TEACHERS AND LEADERS FROM VERMONT AND CONNECTICUT, SO WE’RE REALLY LOOKING TO LEVERAGE THE EXPERIENCES OF TEACHERS IN MICHIGAN, AND THEN TO LOOK BEYOND THE BORDERS SO THAT WE CAN FIND THE BEST PRACTICES THROUGHOUT THE COUNTRY AND BRING THEM HERE. THE NETWORK IS A GREAT OPPORTUNITY FOR REALLY THINKING ABOUT A SHARED VISION FOR ALL SCIENCE TEACHING THROUGHOUT THE STATE, AND WE’RE POSITIONING OURSELVES THROUGH WORKING WITH THE MICHIGAN SCIENCE TEACHERS ASSOCIATION, THE MICHIGAN VIRTUAL UNIVERSITY, AND HIGHER ED TO ADDRESS THOSE CONCERNS THAT YOU MENTIONED THIS MORNING, SO THAT WE VERY MUCH HAVE A COMMON IDEA ABOUT WHAT THE SCIENCE IMPLEMENTATION OUGHT TO LOOK LIKE, AND WE CAN PROVIDE THE KINDS OF SUPPORTS THAT TEACHERS ARE GOING TO NEED HOLISTICALLY AND SYSTEMATICALLY THROUGHOUT THE STATE. THANKS VERY MUCH.>>THANK YOU.>>THANK YOU.>>OUR NEXT SPEAKER IS DAVE KREBS, FOLLOWED BY JENNIFER FLAHERTY.>>DR. FLANAGAN, MEMBERS OF THE BOARD, THANK YOU FOR THE TIME TODAY. MY PURPOSE FOR BEING HERE TODAY IS TO DESCRIBE TO YOU THE CENTER LEVEL VIEW OF WHAT MARY JUST DESCRIBED. THE SECOND DOCUMENT YOU HAVE IS MINE. IT DESCRIBES MY CENTER AND COMES FROM OUR MOST RECENT ANNUAL REPORT. AND ALSO, TO SHOW OUR CAPACITY FOR SUPPORTING OUR SCHOOLS AS THEY MOVE STUDENTS TOWARDS OUTCOMES THAT WE’RE ALL HOPING FOR. THE MUSKEGON-NEWAYGO REGIONAL MATH AND SCIENCE CENTER, MY CENTER, SERVES 34 PUBLIC SCHOOL DISTRICTS, PUBLIC CHARTER ACADEMIES, AND PRIVATE SCHOOLS AND APPROXIMATELY 40,000 STUDENTS. FIFTY-TWO PERCENT OF THE STUDENTS IN MUSKEGON COUNTY RECEIVE FREE AND REDUCED PRICE LUNCHES, AND 67% OF THE STUDENTS IN NEWAYGO COUNTY THE SAME. AS A MATH AND SCIENCE CENTER, WE’RE COMMITTED TO PLANNING WITH OUR LOCAL SCHOOL DISTRICTS IN BOTH COUNTIES FOR SERVICES BASED ON THEIR NEEDS AND TO MAINTAIN A STRONG COLLABORATIVE CULTURE. AS A REGIONAL MATH AND SCIENCE CENTER WITHIN THE INSTRUCTIONAL SERVICES OF AN ISD, OUR STRENGTHS AND CAPACITIES REALLY COME FROM OUR COLLABORATIONS WITHIN OUR OWN ORGANIZATIONS AS ISDs, PARTICIPATION IN THE MATH AND SCIENCE CENTER NETWORK, AND OUR COLLABORATIONS WITH INDIVIDUALS, BUSINESSES, INDUSTRIES, AND NON-PROFIT ORGANIZATIONS IN OUR LOCAL COMMUNITIES. BACK TO OUR OWN ORGANIZATIONS, THE MUSKEGON AREA ISD AND NC RESA. WE COLLABORATE REGULARLY WITH OUR CONSULTANTS FOR MULTI-TIERED SYSTEMS OF SUPPORT, SPECIAL EDUCATION, OUR CONTENT SPECIALISTS, TECHNOLOGY– THOSE FOLKS ARE INVOLVED IN OUR WORK ALL THE TIME. TWO EXAMPLES TAKEN FROM THE DOCUMENT THAT YOU HAVE THERE THAT MIGHT SHED SOME LIGHT ON THAT: SCIENCE PRACTICES THROUGH INQUIRY LITERACY, WHICH IS AN INTEGRATED APPROACH FOR K-5 TEACHERS AS A COLLABORATION BETWEEN SCIENCE AND ELA, ENHANCED INSTRUCTION IN ALGEBRA FOR STUDENTS WITH LEARNING DIFFICULTIES IS IN COLLABORATION WITH OUR SPECIAL EDUCATION DEPARTMENT. WORKING THROUGH THE MATH SCIENCE CENTER NETWORK BRINGS TO THE TABLE EXPERTISE FROM OTHER CENTERS, ISDs, HIGHER ED STEM FACULTY, AND THE MICHIGAN DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION, AS WE PLAN NEW PROFESSIONAL LEARNING PROGRAMS AND SUPPORT FOR MICHIGAN TEACHERS. AS WE WORK WITH OUR LOCAL COMMUNITIES, WE FORGE NEW PARTNERSHIPS EVERY YEAR THAT PROVIDE EXPERTISE, RESOURCES, AND FINANCIAL SUPPORT FOR OUR CENTER’S PROGRAMS, INCLUDING EXPERIENTIAL LEARNING, WHICH IS A STRENGTH FOR OUR CENTER. THAT INVOLVES COMMUNITY-BASED PARTNERSHIPS FOR OUR PLACE-BASED EDUCATION PROGRAMS, WHICH USE THE ENVIRONMENT AS AN INTEGRATING CONTEXT ACROSS DISCIPLINES, AND IS CHARACTERIZED BY EXPLORATION OF THE LOCAL COMMUNITY AND NATURAL ENVIRONMENT, HANDS-ON EXPERIENCES OF DISCOVERY AND PROBLEM-SOLVING OF REAL ENVIRONMENTAL ISSUES IN LOCAL COMMUNITIES, INTERDISCIPLINARY CURRICULA, AND LEARNING THAT ACCOMMODATES INDIVIDUAL STUDENTS’ SKILLS AND ABILITIES. SO IT’S A VERY UNIQUE PROGRAM. MY CENTER IS NOT UNIQUE– THERE’S 33 OF US, AS YOU KNOW. MATH AND SCIENCE CENTERS IN THE MATH AND SCIENCE CENTER NETWORK ARE UNIQUELY POSITIONED AND PREPARED TO SUPPORT MICHIGAN’S TEACHERS AS THEY MOVE IN THE DIRECTION OF SCIENCE INSTRUCTION AS IT’S DESCRIBED IN THE FRAMEWORK FOR K-12 SCIENCE EDUCATION AND AS WE TRANSITION TO NEW STANDARDS. WE KNOW THIS WILL REQUIRE SUBSTANTIAL PROFESSIONAL LEARNING, AND THAT THAT PROFESSIONAL LEARNING NEEDS TO BE DELIVERED IN NEW AND INNOVATIVE WAYS AND MEASURED FOR EFFECTIVENESS. WE’RE WORKING TOGETHER AS A COMMUNITY TO MAKE THAT HAPPEN. THANK YOU FOR MY TIME TODAY.>>THANK YOU.>>THE NEXT PERSON IS JENNIFER FLAHERTY, FOLLOWED BY TRACY PETERS.>>GOOD AFTERNOON. MY NAME IS JENNIFER, AND I HAVE TWIN 13-YEAR-OLD BOYS IN THE LIVONIA PUBLIC SCHOOL SYSTEM. I’VE HAD PERSONAL EXPERIENCE WITH MDE. I HAVE FILED COMPLAINTS FOR BOTH OF MY SONS, AND THE DISTRICT WAS FOUND NON-COMPLIANT. THE THING THAT THE MDE DOES IS THEY TELL THE DISTRICT, “DON’T DO IT AGAIN.” AND THAT’S IT. WHEN YOU HAVE QUESTIONS, LIKE THAT WONDERFUL PHONE NUMBER THAT THEY PUT UP, THEY WILL SAY THAT THEY’LL LOOK INTO IT. THEY DON’T CALL YOU BACK. YOU CAN EMAIL MANY TIMES. THEY WILL NOT REALLY GET TO THE POINT OF THE ANSWER THAT YOU’RE SEEKING. INSTEAD, I HAVE BEEN ACCUSED OF PUTTING MY NAME ON DOCUMENTS THAT WEREN’T EVEN MY OWN WORDS OR THOUGHTS. AND YOU SPEND A LOT OF TIME TALKING ABOUT SYSTEMIC COMPLAINTS. MY ONE FROM MY ONE SON WAS SYSTEMIC. IT HAD A NAME– IT WAS MY SON. FOUND THE DISTRICT NON-COMPLIANT, BUT NEVER INVESTIGATED. AND THIS WAS A COUNTY PROBLEM WITH A COMPUTER GLITCH FOR WAYNE COUNTY, AND THIS WAS TWO YEARS AGO. AND EVERY TIME I GO INTO A MEETING, I SAY, “DID THEY EVER FIX THAT?” “NO, THEY NEVER DID.” “DID THEY EVER INVESTIGATE THAT?” “NO, NO, NO INVESTIGATION.” SO THE APPEARANCE THAT THEY’RE TRYING TO MAKE, THAT THEY’RE TRYING TO BE HELPFUL TO PARENTS AND TRYING TO MAKE THE PROCESS EASIER, IS NOT– THAT’S NOT TRUTHFUL. THEY’RE NOT. THEY GIVE YOU THESE PROCEDURAL SAFEGUARDS, AS WE LIKE TO CALL THEM. THEY’RE THE PINK PIECES OF PAPER. ALL US PARENTS, WE CAN’T MAKE HEADS OR TAILS OUT OF IT. THE SPECIAL ED SYSTEM IS LIKE TRYING TO NAVIGATE A MINEFIELD, AND IT’S HARD TO DO BY YOURSELF. YOU REALLY NEED TO HAVE SOMEBODY BY YOUR SIDE, AND THEY DON’T MAKE IT ANY EASIER. THEY REALLY DON’T. SO YOU GUYS ARE THE ONLY PEOPLE THAT WE CAN VOTE FOR, RIGHT? I’VE VOTED FOR SOME OF YOU. [ LAUGHTER ]>>THESE PEOPLE– I CAN’T VOTE OR NOT VOTE FOR THEM. I HAVE NO POWER OVER WHAT GOES ON, AND THIS IS A GOVERNMENT ENTITY, RIGHT? SO I REALLY IMPLORE YOU TO REALLY LOOK AT WHAT THEY’RE DOING AND HOW THEY HANDLE THEIR DEPARTMENT AND MAKE APPROPRIATE CHANGES. THAT’S GOING TO HELP NOT JUST THE KIDS– BECAUSE THESE ARE MY CHILDREN– BUT US PARENTS, WHO ARE TRYING TO ADVOCATE FOR OUR CHILDREN, AND WE GET BLOCKED EVERY STEP OF THE WAY. THANK YOU.>>THANK YOU.>>THE NEXT SPEAKER IS TRACY PETERS, FOLLOWED BY CYNTHIA DESMON.>>OKAY. THANK YOU, SUPERINTENDENT FLANAGAN AND BOARD MEMBERS, FOR HEARING MY REMARKS. JUST A FEW THINGS. I’M HERE BECAUSE THIS IS THE FIRST MEETING AFTER THE ELECTION. TO ME, THAT’S KIND OF A CYCLICAL TIME TO COME AND, AS A CONSTITUENT, COME AND STATE WHAT MY EXPECTATIONS ARE, AND WHAT EXPECTATIONS I’M WILLING TO HELP YOU ACHIEVE. SO CONGRATULATIONS TO ALL OF YOU WHO ARE MOVING ON TO DIFFERENT ENDEAVORS, STAYING, AND RE-ELECTED. YOU’RE LIKE MY MOTHERSHIP. AS A HYBRID TEACHER-ATTORNEY, I HAVE TO SAY, THIS IS WHERE I COME. THERE WAS A GOOD, SPIRITED DISCUSSION THIS MORNING, BOTH ON THE SCIENCE STANDARDS, REPRESENTATIVE WEISER, AND WITHIN SPECIAL EDUCATION, REPRESENTATIVE FECTEAU. BOY, I’M REALLY KIND OF BUMPING UP YOUR LEGISLATIVE STATUS, AREN’T I? [ LAUGHTER ]>>OR DOWN. [ LAUGHTER ]>>LISTEN, AN ELECTED BODY CAN BE SPIRITED WITHOUT BEING AN ACTIVIST, JUST LIKE A COURT CAN. I THINK WHEN YOU’RE WELL INFORMED AND YOU HAVE SPIRITED DISCUSSIONS, THAT’S NOT ACTIVISM. SOMETIMES PEOPLE CRITICIZE MY PROFESSION AND MY JUDGE AS JUDICIAL ACTIVISM, MAKING LAW FROM A BENCH. I REALLY LIKE THAT. I HOPE YOU’LL KEEP IT UP. I MIGHT SUGGEST A TIME CLOCK FOR SOME OF THE MORNING SESSIONS IN THE FUTURE. LASTLY, THIS ARRIVED YESTERDAY, AND PLEASE SHARE IT WITH YOUR SPECIAL EDUCATION STAFF. THIS MONTH’S BAR JOURNAL HAS AN EXCLUSIVE SECTION DEVOTED TO SPECIAL NEEDS LAW. AND THERE IS A SECTION THAT MIGHT IMPACT WHAT YOUR STAFF DOES. IT’S MORE FOCUSED ON ELDER LAW, BUT I THINK IT’S A VALUABLE RESOURCE TO SHARE. AND LASTLY, THE ACTION THAT I’M ASKING YOU TO TAKE, AND SUPPORTED BY THE LEGAL AUTHORITY OF THE MICHIGAN CONSTITUTION, ARTICLE 8 SECTION 3, IS TO PLEASE PROVIDE GENERAL GUIDANCE AND PLANNING FOR MICHIGAN’S SYSTEM OF PUBLIC EDUCATION. I REALLY FEEL, OUT THERE IN THE EDUCATION COMMUNITY, THAT IT’S A BIG, CONFUSING MESS, TO ME AND TO PARENTS. I DON’T KNOW HOW YOU CAN IDENTIFY YOUR MAIN BENCHMARKS GOING FORTH. I KNOW YOU HAVE FEDERAL AND STATE MANDATES, BUT I THINK ABOUT AN ISSUE COMING UP IN DETROIT– AND I AM FROM DETROIT, AND I KNOW PEOPLE HAVE A TENDENCY TO TALK ABOUT DETROIT. WELL, ALL EYES IN OUR STATE ARE ON US BECAUSE OF THE BANKRUPTCY. DON’T THINK FOR A SECOND THAT THEY’RE NOT ON OUR SCHOOLS BECAUSE OF THE EAA OR CHARTERS– WE HAVE SO MANY, AS BOARD MEMBER VARNER SAID, SO MANY TYPES OF SCHOOLS. I NEED YOU TO BE PREPARED, UNDER YOUR AUTHORITY, TO ISSUE A RESOLUTION ON THIS ISSUE OF MAYORAL CONTROL. IF IT’S NOT MAYORAL CONTROL, BY MAYOR MIKE DUGGAN, I’M CONCERNED THAT THERE MAY BE A GROUP COMING TOGETHER TO LEAD THE DISTRICT WITHOUT LEGAL AUTHORITY. AND I NEED YOU TO BE TALKING ABOUT THAT AND BE PREPARED TO ISSUE A RESOLUTION ON THAT. THANK YOU. AND I WILL SUPPORT YOU WITH ANY FACT FINDING THAT’S NECESSARY.>>THANK YOU.>>JUST NOTING, FOR THE RECORD, THAT I WAS NOT REPRESENTATIVE VARNER. I WAS BOARD MEMBER VARNER. [ LAUGHTER ]>>I CORRECTED MYSELF.>>WELL PUT. [ LAUGHTER ]>>BECAUSE YOU’RE ELECTED STATEWIDE, AND THAT IS A HIGHER AUTHORITY.>>WELL.>>THAT’S RIGHT.>>CYNTHIA DESMON?>>YES, MA’AM.>>AND SHE’LL BE FOLLOWED BY MARCIE LIPSITT.>>I JUST WANT TO SHARE WITH YOU THAT PUBLIC SPEAKING SCARES ME HALF TO DEATH, AND YET I’M HERE, SO YOU KNOW IT MUST BE IMPORTANT FOR ME TO SHOW UP. I’M NOT REPRESENTING TROY PAC TODAY, BUT I AM REPRESENTING THE FAMILIES THAT ARE PART OF OUR DISTRICT. NOT EVERYONE CAN TAKE THE DAY OFF WORK AND COME IN, AND WHEN PARENTS HAVE QUESTIONS OR CONCERNS, EVEN GENERAL ED PARENTS, A LOT OF TIMES, THEY WILL COME TO ME. ONE, BECAUSE I PROTECT THEIR PRIVACY, BUT ALSO I’M CONCERNED FOR THEM AND THEIR FAMILIES. I UNDERSTAND WHAT IT’S LIKE TO STRUGGLE EVERY DAY, AND AS PARENTS, YOU ALL KNOW THAT IT’S HARD. THERE’S NOTHING HARDER YOU COULD EVER DO. BECAUSE OF TIME, I HAD TO CHANGE THINGS OUT, AND I TOOK NOTES WHILE I WAS LISTENING TO MDE. I HAVE CALLED MDE. I MOVED TO TROY IN 2006, AND IT WAS THE WORST 4 YEARS OF MY LIFE WAS SPENT IN THAT DISTRICT, BECAUSE I CAME FROM A DISTRICT THAT WAS PECKING AT ME FROM THE TIME MY CHILD WAS TWO AND A HALF, TO GIVE HIM SPEECH AND TO GO INTO THIS SEPARATE PROGRAM, AND I DIDN’T WANT THAT. I WANTED INCLUSION. I PROVIDED THE SPEECH. WE PROVIDED PRIVATE SPEECH, PRIVATE OT, PRIVATE TUTORING THROUGH THE HOSPITAL, BECAUSE I WANTED MY CHILD TO BE ABLE TO LEARN AND SUCCEED. SO I PAID FOR IT ALL BY CASH. NONE OF IT IS COVERED BY INSURANCE. BUT EVERY TIME I WOULD GO FOR AN EVAL, I WAS TURNED DOWN, AND I WOULD CALL THE MDE SPECIAL ED OFFICE, AND GOT NO ANSWERS. NO ONE OFFERED TO HELP ME WRITE A COMPLAINT. NO ONE OFFERED TO HELP ME DO ANYTHING. AND I WAS LUCKY ENOUGH THAT I WAS REMOVED FROM THAT SCHOOL BY MY SPECIAL ED DIRECTOR, WHO WAS A FABULOUS DIRECTOR, AND THE CURRENT ONE IS NOW, TOO. AND THEY REALLY SUPPORTED ME, AND THEY TOOK THE REPORTS. “WELL, WHY DID HE NOT DO WELL HERE?” AND THEY TOOK HIS REPORTS THAT WERE ALL PRIVATE– I PAID FOR ALL PRIVATE TESTING, BECAUSE TROY AND PROBABLY A LOT OF OTHER SCHOOLS DON’T DO EVERY SINGLE LITTLE SECTION OF THE TEST. THEY PICK AND CHOOSE WHAT THEY WANT TO DO. AND THEY COULD FIND OUT WHY HE WASN’T DOING WELL. “WELL, LOOK, THE PROBLEM IS UP HERE AT THE TOP. THEY EXPECTED HIM TO COPY IT DOWN HERE AT THE BOTTOM. HE HAS SEVERE WORKING MEMORY ISSUES. WHY WOULD THEY THINK THAT HE COULD DO THAT? HOW CAN WE SUPPORT THAT? WHAT COULD WE DO DIFFERENTLY?” IT’S IMPORTANT THAT WE GET THE RIGHT SUPPORT, AND SOMETIMES THERE’S NOT ENOUGH TIME IF THERE’S 28 KIDS IN A CLASS OR MORE– I DON’T KNOW WHAT THE PERCENTAGE IS, BUT THERE’S OBVIOUSLY MORE THAN JUST HIM IN THE CLASS THAT HAS A SPECIAL NEED. FOR WRITING THE COMPLAINTS, A LOT OF PARENTS HAVE NO KNOWLEDGE OF THIS. THEY ARE NEVER TOLD THAT TROY PAC EXISTS, OR ANY OTHER PARENT ADVISORY GROUPS. THEY’RE UNABLE TO FILL OUT THE FORM. OFTENTIMES, THE APPLE DOESN’T FALL FAR FROM THE TREE. I KNOW THAT, OBVIOUSLY, AFTER MY CHILD WAS DIAGNOSED, THAT HEY, THAT’S WHAT I HAVE. THAT’S WHY I STRUGGLED THAT WAY. FEAR OF RETALIATION, YES. STAFF CAN BE VERY CRUEL BECAUSE THEY DON’T KNOW. WE’VE LEARNED SO MUCH IN THE LAST FEW YEARS WHAT AUTISM LOOKS LIKE. IT DOESN’T ALWAYS LOOK LIKE THIS. IT CAN LOOK ALL THE WAY OVER HERE LIKE THIS. HIS BEHAVIORS AREN’T BEING WRITTEN RIGHT. THERE’S NO BEHAVIOR PLAN PUT IN PLACE TO SUPPORT THE STUDENTS SO THEY CAN BE SUCCESSFUL AND FIT INTO THEIR PEER GROUP. THE PROCEDURAL SAFEGUARDS– CAN’T READ IT. IF YOU COULD PUT LIKE A SIDE-BY-SIDE. A LOT OF THINGS IN THE STATE HAVE THAT, STATE RULES, FEDERAL RULES. SORRY.>>NO, PLEASE, YOU CAN FINISH.>>THAT WOULD JUST BE HELPFUL. THE APPLE REALLY DOES NOT FALL THAT FAR FROM THE TREE. IF I’M DYSLEXIC, WHAT ARE THE CHANCES THAT MY CHILDREN WILL BE? ARE THEY ABLE TO BE READ TO THAT PARENT? IS THERE A LINK? A LOT OF THE WEBSITES, I THINK IT’S CALLED UNDERSTOOD RIGHT NOW, IT’S A WEBSITE. YOU CAN CLICK ON A BUTTON AND IT’LL READ THE ARTICLE TO YOU. ALSO, FOR US, I CAN’T UNDERSTAND WHY ANYBODY WOULD WANT US TO GO TO A LAWSUIT. DUE PROCESS IS A LAWSUIT. YOU HAVE TO BE ABLE TO AFFORD AN ATTORNEY. WHAT IF WE CAN’T? DOES THAT MEAN WE’RE GOING TO A CASTE SYSTEM? IF YOU DON’T HAVE MONEY, YOU’RE NOT EDUCATED BECAUSE YOU DON’T HAVE THE KNOWLEDGE TO FIGHT? SO YOU HAVE A PARENT THAT HAS A DISABILITY, YOU HAVE A CHILD THAT HAS THE DISABILITY, THE SCHOOL DISTRICT HAS THE KNOWLEDGE, BUT WON’T PROVIDE IT. AND IT’S JUST GOING TO KEEP LOOPING OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN. SO WHY WOULD WE WANT TO GO TO DUE PROCESS? WHY WOULD A PARENT WANT TO SUE? WHY WOULD THE STATE WANT US TO SUE? IT TAKES UP TIME AND MONEY, AND IT’S JUST RIDICULOUS THAT THEY WOULD EVEN SUGGEST THAT FOR ANY FAMILY OR ANYONE. YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO SIT DOWN, LIKE I DID, WITH THE ACTUAL PERSON THAT’S IN CHARGE, THE DIRECTOR, TO COME UP WITH A PLAN TO SOLVE AN ISSUE. BECAUSE A LOT OF TIMES, THE PEOPLE THAT ARE WRITING THESE PLANS ARE PRINCIPALS THAT DON’T HAVE ANY BACKGROUND IN SPECIAL ED, BUT THEY GET TO MAKE THOSE DECISIONS. AND IT DOESN’T MAKE SENSE. AND THE FINAL THING IS THAT YOU’RE THE STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION. YOU NEED TO ACT ON BEHALF OF ALL CHILDREN. IF YOU LISTEN TO DR. MACHESKY, SUPERINTENDENT OF TROY, HIS MESSAGE FOR THE FIRST 90 DAYS: “ONE TROY, ALL CHILDREN.” ALL CHILDREN, EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM, WILL BE EDUCATED AND SUPPORTED. AND I THOUGHT THAT THAT WAS THE PERFECT MESSAGE THAT HE SENT FOR HIS FIRST 90 DAYS, AND HE CONTINUALLY SAYS THAT. I THINK THAT’S A POSITIVE MESSAGE. SO THANK YOU.>>THANK YOU.>>OUR FINAL SPEAKER IS MARCIE LIPSETT.>>GOOD AFTERNOON. I, MORE THAN MOST, VALUE EVERY MEMBER OF THIS STATE BOARD. I VALUE THE FACT THAT YOU ARE ELECTED SEATS IN THE STATE OF MICHIGAN. I WAS REMINDED AT THE OVERSIGHT HEARING THAT REP McMILLIN HELD ON SEPTEMBER 23rd, THAT WHILE I HAVE FOUGHT TIRELESSLY SINCE 2007 TO SEE THE STATE BOARD’S AUTHORITY RESTORED TO STATE EDUCATION, PRETTY SUCCESSFULLY IN THE HOUSE– IT PASSED IN 2007 88-20. IT WOULD HAVE PASSED THE SENATE WITH THE EXCEPTION OF THE CHAIR OF THE SENATE ED COMMITTEE. BUT I WAS REMINDED BY REP TIM KELLY THAT, IN FACT, THE STATE BOARD DOESN’T REALLY NEED THE AUTHORITY RESTORED, BECAUSE YOU IN FACT HAVE ALL THE AUTHORITY TO HIRE AND FIRE THE STATE SUPERINTENDENT. I WOULD ASK THAT ALL OF YOU REMEMBER THAT. THIS HAS BEEN A VERY CHALLENGING TIME IN MICHIGAN FOR SPECIAL EDUCATION. MY REPUTATION ALWAYS PRECEDES ME. I ALWAYS THINK IT’S FASCINATING TO HEAR ABOUT ME, NOT NECESSARILY IN A GOOD LIGHT. I DON’T FIGHT TO FIGHT EVER. I FIGHT FOR KIDS, AND FRANKLY, I THINK THEY DESERVE THAT. I THINK WE WANT EVERY CHILD IN MICHIGAN TO BE A TAXPAYER. THE MAJORITY CAN. IT’S THE SMALL MINORITY WHO CAN’T. I HAVE WATCHED SPECIAL EDUCATION ERODE IN MICHIGAN, GOING BACK TO GOVERNOR ENGLER’S EXECUTIVE ORDERS. WITH EVERY REAUTHORIZATION OF THE FEDERAL LAW AND OUR STATE RULES– 2001, 2007, AND RIGHT NOW, THEY’RE IN A PERIOD OF REVISION. I HAVE WATCHED THE RULES ERODE. I HAVE WATCHED PARENTS’ PROCEDURAL SAFEGUARDS ERODE. AND FRANKLY, THE OUTCOMES OF THE CHILDREN HAVEN’T IMPROVED. IF THE OUTCOMES OF THE CHILDREN HAD IMPROVED, I WOULDN’T BE DOING THIS SEVEN DAYS A WEEK, 90% AS A VOLUNTEER. I’VE SEEN TREMENDOUS DETERIORATION SINCE 2010. I ATTRIBUTE THAT TO MICHIGAN’S MISGUIDED ABUSE OF THE FEDERAL STIMULUS DOLLARS RESPECTIVE TO SPECIAL EDUCATION. WHEN THE AMERICAN RECOVERY REINVESTMENT ACT INCLUDED $12 BILLION IN SPECIAL EDUCATION, AND MICHIGAN WAS ONE OF THREE STATES THAT, FRANKLY, MADE A MESS OF THAT MONEY, AND GAVE EVERY SCHOOL DISTRICT IN MICHIGAN PERMISSION TO REDUCE THEIR LOCAL SPECIAL ED BUDGETS BY UP TO 50%. I CAN GIVE YOU EXAMPLES OF DISTRICTS THAT REDUCED BY UP TO 50%. THEY WOULD INCLUDE PLYMOUTH AND WALLED LAKE AND ROCHESTER– DISTRICTS THAT WOULD SURPRISE YOU. SINCE THAT REDUCTION IN FUNDS, I’VE HAD MORE AND MORE PARENTS SAYING TO ME, “MY CHILD CAN’T GET SPEECH,” “MY CHILD CAN’T GET OCCUPATIONAL THERAPY OR PHYSICAL THERAPY.” THE WAYNE RESA PUT OUT A DOCUMENT THIS YEAR THAT CHILDREN IN CENTER-BASED PROGRAMS– 1 SOCIAL WORKER TO EVERY 100 CHILDREN, 1 SPEECH CLINICIAN TO EVERY 60 CHILDREN. CHILDREN ARE NOT BEING SERVICED. THE MICHIGAN DEPARTMENT OF ED– I HAD A RESPECTFUL RELATIONSHIP WITH JACKIE THOMPSON WHEN SHE WAS THIS DIRECTOR. SHE PRECEDED ELEANOR WHITE AND TERI JOHNSON. AND CLEARLY, WE DID NOT ALWAYS AGREE, BUT WE RESPECTFULLY AGREED TO DISAGREE. THAT HAS NOT BEEN TRUE WITH ELEANOR, OR, FRANKLY, WITH TERI JOHNSON. I WISH THAT WAS. COMPLAINTS ARE NOT BEING INVESTIGATED THE WAY THEY SHOULD BE. OUTCOMES OR CORRECTIVE ACTION IS NOT ENSURED. TWO OUT OF THREE EAA COMPLAINTS THAT I FILED WITH CORRECTIVE ACTION PLANS, THERE’S BEEN NO CORRECTIVE ACTION. I AM THE FILER OF THE MUSKEGON HEIGHTS COMPLAINTS. THE SUBSEQUENT COMPLAINTS THAT I HAVE FILED HAD VERY CLEAR ALLEGATIONS OF FACT. THEY WERE DISMISSED IN WHOLE, NOT EVEN IN PART. AND I WOULD ASK THAT THE STATE BOARD REMEMBERS THAT YOU ARE ALL ELECTED. I WORK HARD TO ELECT YOU. I SPEND HOURS DURING THE CAMPAIGN EDUCATING PEOPLE ON WHO IS RUNNING FOR EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THESE BOARD SEATS. THIS IS NOT CEREMONIAL. THIS IS NOT HONORARY. YOU HOLD A REAL JUDICIARY OBLIGATION WHEN YOU DECIDE TO RUN AND ARE ELECTED TO THIS BOARD. EVERY CHILD IN MICHIGAN IS DEPENDING UPON YOU. I WILL END ON A PERSONAL NOTE. I AM INCREDIBLY TROUBLED TO KNOW THAT, AS A PARENT OF A CHILD WITH A DISABILITY AND A SIBLING OF A SISTER WITH A DISABILITY, THAT OUR CURRENT STATE SUPERINTENDENT WILL REFER TO SOMEONE LIKE ME AS A WHEELCHAIR PROTESTER. I WAS SADDENED BY THAT, AND I THINK THAT IT FRANKLY SPEAKS TO THE WHOLE CULTURE IN THE MICHIGAN DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION RIGHT NOW. THANK YOU.>>THANK YOU.>>I BELIEVE THAT’S THE END OF PUBLIC PARTICIPATION. AM I CORRECT IN THAT? THANK YOU.>>I KNOW WE CAN’T RESPOND. SO THAT’S PART OF WHAT YOU HAVE TO GET USED TO IN PUBLIC WORK, GUYS. JUST TAKE A DEEP BREATH, AND– I DON’T HAVE TO FOREVER. I’M WRITING A BOOK. MY BOOK WILL BE–>>YOU’RE NOT NAMING NAMES, ARE YOU? JUST INITIALS– J.A.–>>I JUST THINK THE RECORD AND THE WHOLE SYSTEM HAS ITS FLAWS, BUT I’M LOOKING FORWARD TO SPENDING SOME TIME ON THAT. LET’S SEE. SO WE’RE– WE DON’T HAVE INTRODUCTION OF ANY NEW EMPLOYEES TODAY. THERE ARE A FEW, BUT THEY’RE NOT WITH US. SO I THINK WE’LL GO RIGHT TO YOU, JOHN. MAY I JUST SAY ALSO, WHATEVER THE BOARD– WE TALKED ABOUT THIS AS A TEAM AT MDE– WHATEVER THE BOARD DECIDES, WE WANT TO SUPPORT FULLY. WE WANT TO HELP ENCOURAGE AND TAKE YOUR LEADERSHIP ON THAT.>>ON TO A LESS CONTROVERSIAL ITEM, SCHOOL FINANCE. [ LAUGHTER ]>>MOVING RIGHT ALONG. WE’LL GET TO TESTING LATER. [ LAUGHTER ]>>SO MARILYN’S GOT THE LATEST DRAFT. WE WANTED TO RUN THIS PROCESS OF PUBLIC DISCUSSION A YEAR OF EXAMINATION OF OUR SCHOOL ORGANIZATION FINANCE SYSTEM, AND WHY WE DECIDED, WITH CASANDRA AND OTHERS’ GOOD ENCOURAGEMENT, LET’S SPLIT OUR DISCUSSION INTO TWO PARTS. WHAT ARE THE MAIN CHALLENGES, WHAT HAVE WE LEARNED, AND THEN WHAT ARE SOME RECOMMENDATIONS FOR IMPROVEMENT THAT ATTEND TO THOSE CHALLENGES? SO I THOUGHT WE’D SPLIT IT INTO THE FIRST DISCUSSION TODAY. WE DID THIS SO THAT WE CAN CONTRIBUTE AND ENCOURAGE THE KIND OF PUBLIC DISCUSSION AND ATTENTION BY ALL OF US, AND HOPEFULLY ATTENTION AS A STATE AND OUR GOVERNOR AND LEGISLATURE, AS WE MOVE AHEAD TO ATTENDING TO SOME OF THE BIG CHALLENGES IN THE WAY WE ORGANIZE AND FINANCE SCHOOLS THAT ARE INCREASINGLY, I THINK, AND WHAT I HOPE WE CAN AGREE ON, ACHIEVEMENT, WHICH IS THE ONLY REASON WHY WE SHOULD CARE ABOUT ALL THIS. SO IF YOU LOOK AT– I JUST WANT TO REITERATE, TOO, WE SPENT THE LAST YEAR LISTENING TO A LOT OF PERSPECTIVES ON WHAT’S BROKE, WHAT’S WRONG, WHAT ARE THE PROBLEMS, WHAT ARE THE RECOMMENDATIONS FOR CHANGE FROM THE PUBLIC, FROM A WIDE VARIETY OF INFORMED AND THOUGHTFUL STAKEHOLDERS AND POLICY ANALYSTS AND RESEARCHERS, AGAIN, FROM ACROSS THE IDEOLOGICAL OR POLICY SPECTRUM, FROM VIEWED AS CONSERVATIVE TO VIEWED AS LIBERAL. I THINK YOU’LL NOTICE THAT WHEN WE PUT TOGETHER THIS ANALYSIS, LEANING VERY HEAVILY ON THOSE WHO ARE CREDIBLY RIGHT DOWN THE MIDDLE IN TERMS OF RESPECT FOR THEIR INTEGRITY AND NOT IMBUED WITH BIAS IN EITHER DIRECTION. THE CHILDREN’S RESEARCH COUNCIL, THE CENTER FOR MICHIGAN, OTHERS WHO ARE CITED FOR THEIR ANALYSIS. THIS IS AN EFFORT TO TRY TO FORGE SOME CREDIBLE UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT THE CHALLENGES ARE. AND I THINK THESE CHALLENGES REALLY DEMAND OUR ATTENTION, AND WE SHOULD REALLY BE ACTIVE IN FORMING RECOMMENDATIONS FOR WHERE WE GO AND HOW WE DO BETTER AS A STATE. SO LET ME JUST QUICKLY FLAG WHAT’S IN THIS DOCUMENT FOR OTHERS WHO ARE WITH US. I THINK THE MAJOR CHALLENGES INCLUDE, AS A START, AN ACKNOWLEDGEMENT THAT WE’RE NOT PERFORMING. OTHER STATES ARE IMPROVING ACHIEVEMENT FASTER, AND OUR ACHIEVEMENT, WHERE ONCE A LEADER, IS RELATIVELY STAGNANT AND NOT WORKING. AND THAT’S THE MAIN PURPOSE OF WHY WE NEED TO MAKE SOME CHANGE IN HOW WE ORGANIZE AND FINANCE EDUCATION, SO THAT WE CAN IMPROVE OUTCOMES AND LEARNING PERFORMANCE FOR ALL OF OUR YOUNG PEOPLE. I THINK THE TOPIC OF THE OVERALL LEVEL OF EFFORT OR AN OVERALL INVESTMENT IN EDUCATION IS VERY CONTENTIOUS, AS WE SAY IN THIS DOCUMENT. IT’S IMPORTANT TO NOTE, OUR ABSOLUTE SPENDING LEVEL IS 22nd IN THE NATION. BY CAPITA INCOME, 8th. ACHIEVEMENT, AGAIN, 38th. WE AS A STATE SPEND MORE THAN SOME STATES THAT GET BETTER OUTCOMES AND ARE MOVING UP FASTER. AND WE SPEND LESS THAN SOME STATES WHO ALSO GET BETTER OUTCOMES AND MOVE UP FASTER. BUT THE REAL DOLLARS, THE EFFORT LEVEL AND SORT OF BUDGET PRIORITY OVERALL AS A STATE HAS DIMINISHED OVER THE RELATIVE TIME FRAME OF TEN OR A DOZEN YEARS. THE INVESTMENT HAS REALLY DROPPED, AND THE SHARE OF PERSONAL INCOME. TO ME, THAT WAS THE MOST TELLING STATISTIC. JUST AS A LEVEL OF EFFORT, WHATEVER MONEY WE HAVE TO SPEND IN MICHIGAN, HOWEVER MUCH INCOME YOU MAKE, THROUGH GOOD TIMES AND BAD, WHAT ARE WE INVESTING IN K-12? AND IT’S DROPPED FROM 4.1% OF OUR INCOME AS A STATE, WHATEVER THAT MAY BE, TO 3.4%, WHICH JUST SPEAKS OF WHETHER WE’RE PUTTING IT AS A BUDGET PRIORITY. AND WITH RECENT BILLIONS OF DOLLARS MORE IN PUBLIC EDUCATION– BUT AS THE CRC NOTES, AND WE ALL KNOW, IT’S BEEN USEFULLY AND NEEDFULLY GOING TO BENEFITS AND ATTENDING TO THOSE THINGS. AND IT HAS NOT GOTTEN IMPACT IN THE CLASSROOM, WHERE THERE ARE, TO A DIMINISHED CAPACITY, HIGHER TEACHER RATIOS, ACCORDING TO THE CRC, IN MOST OF OUR SCHOOLS, AND JUST LESS ABILITY TO PUT THAT MONEY INTO THE CLASSROOM. AND AGAIN, I’M ACKNOWLEDGING VERY CLEARLY THAT WE HAVE TO SPEND SMARTER. WE AS A STATE ARE NOT SPENDING SMART, WHATEVER WE’RE SPENDING. WE HAVE NOT BEEN PUTTING THE MONEY BEHIND THE STRATEGIC INVESTMENTS THAT LIFT ACHIEVEMENT LIKE OTHER STATES. WE MADE AND DEMANDED ALL THE REFORMS: HIGHER EXPECTATIONS FOR OUR TEACHERS, FOR OUR STUDENTS WITH THE LEARNING STANDARDS, AND WE’RE TALKING ABOUT MORE THIS MORNING, AND WE HAVE NOT BACKED THOSE WITH THE INVESTMENT OF CAPACITY TO IMPLEMENT AND STRATEGIC SUPPORT FOR TEACHERS IN PARTICULAR, PROFESSIONAL DEVELOPMENT. WE’RE DOING A LITTLE BETTER IN EARLY CHILDHOOD, A STRATEGIC INVESTMENT THAT MAKES A LOT OF SENSE. WE ALSO HAVE NOT DONE– AS DAN MENTIONED, ALL THE OTHER STATES, THE HIGH PERFORMING STATES, ON BALANCE, SPEND MONEY DIFFERENTIALLY. THEY PUT MONEY WHERE IT’S NEEDED. MORE GOES TO KIDS WITH SPECIAL NEEDS, SPENDING MORE TO GET EQUITY, AS DEFINED AS GETTING AN EQUAL SHOT AT LEARNING, NOT EQUAL DOLLAR PER PUPIL. SO IT’S IMPORTANT TO UNDERSTAND THAT DIFFERENTIAL SUPPORT TO GET THE OUTCOMES THAT ALL KIDS DESERVE. AND WE HAVEN’T BACKED THE TURNAROUND DEMANDS OF OUR SCHOOLS WITH REAL CAPACITY AND SUPPORT LIKE THE HIGH ACHIEVING STATES PUT TOGETHER. THE THIRD TOPIC IS JUST AN ACKNOWLEDGMENT THAT IN AN ERA OF OVERALL DECLINES IN ENROLLMENTS AS A STATE, OUR WHAT I WOULD CALL INCHOATE CHOICE OF CHARTER AND NEW SCHOOL STRATEGY IS CONTRIBUTING OVERALL TO DIMINISHING OUTCOMES AND PERFORMANCE FOR MOST OF OUR SCHOOLS AND STUDENTS. I MEAN, I THINK THE CRC PUT IT THE MOST ELEGANTLY OR DELICATELY. WE’RE SENDING A MIXED MESSAGE WHEN WE’RE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO CONSOLIDATE AND CLOSE MORE SCHOOLS WHILE WE’RE ALSO OPENING NEW ONES. AND EVEN IF YOU BELIEVE, AS I DO, THAT THERE’S AN IMPORTANT ROLE FOR CHARTERS AND CHOICE. WITHOUT A STRATEGY TO HELP THE CHARTER AND CHOICE IMPROVE THE LEARNING OUTCOMES FOR MOST OF OUR STUDENTS AND ALL OF OUR STUDENTS, THEN WE DON’T HAVE ANY STRATEGY. AND I THINK ATTENDING TO SOME THOUGHTFUL STRATEGY FOR HOW WE DO BETTER SO THAT OUR SYSTEM OF CHOICE, CHARTER, AND EXISTING SCHOOLS, IN A PERIOD OF DECLINING ENROLLMENTS, WHICH IS DRIVING THIS FINANCIAL WHIP SONG AS SCHOOL DISTRICTS AS THEY GAIN OR LOSE STUDENTS, CONTRIBUTING TO THEIR FINANCIAL AND ACADEMIC DISTRESS. AND FINALLY, THERE ARE A NUMBER OF SIGNIFICANT HOLES AND PROBLEMS SINCE PROPOSAL A, AND I THINK MOST OF THEM CAN HAVE SOME THOUGHTFUL SOLUTIONS TO, WHICH WE’LL TALK ABOUT NEXT. PROPOSAL A PROVIDED NO RESOURCES FOR CAPITAL AND INFRASTRUCTURE. DOUG ROBERTS ACKNOWLEDGES THAT THEY JUST DIDN’T GET THAT IN. AND IT’S A REAL CHALLENGE. THERE’S BEEN SIGNIFICANT FRUSTRATION, I THINK. THE PROPOSAL A FOUNDERS, AS WE HEARD, THOUGHT THAT THE 3% MILL FOR LOCAL, REGIONAL ISD MILLS, THEY PROVIDED AVENUES FOR LOCALS THAT WANTED TO PUT MORE MONEY TO RAISE MORE FOR LOCAL SCHOOLS. IT JUST DIDN’T WORK POLITICALLY. ONLY A HANDFUL OF PEOPLE HAVE MADE IT WORK. SO I THINK EVERYBODY CAN AGREE THERE’S GOT TO BE SOME THOUGHTFUL MECHANISM FOR LOCALS’ ABILITY TO RAISE SOME MONEY THAT DOESN’T BUILD A BIG EQUITY DIVIDE AGAIN, AND THERE’S GOOD IDEAS ON HOW TO DO THAT. WE STILL HAVE A FINANCING SYSTEM THAT DISCOURAGES RATHER THAN ENCOURAGES DUAL ENROLLMENT AND EARLY COLLEGE CREDIT TAKING, WHICH WE ALL AGREE IS WILDLY EFFECTIVE, FOR AT-RISK AND HIGH ACHIEVERS, SOMETHING THE GOVERNOR AND OTHERS WOULD LIKE TO DO BETTER ON. WE HAVE THIS ISSUE OF THE COST OF RETIREMENT AND HEALTHCARE THAT NEEDS SOME MORE THOUGHTFUL ATTENTION FOR A VARIETY OF REASONS, AND YOU CAN SEE THAT I GOT SOME COMMENTS BACK THAT WERE INCORPORATED INTO THIS DRAFT. JUST– THERE’S MANY REASONS TO EXPLAIN THAT COST. IT’S NOT TO PIN IT ON THESE TEACHERS ARE GETTING ANY OVER-GENEROUS BENEFITS. THERE’S A COMPLEX OF REASONS. BUT WE NEED SOME FIXES FOR THAT. AND FINALLY, WE’VE HEARD SOME TODAY THAT THE SPECIAL EDUCATION SERVICES AND THE SPREAD IN THEIR DELIVERY AND THE FINANCIAL COSTS ARE A HUGE ISSUE THAT DESERVE SOME THOUGHTFUL ATTENTION. SO I THINK AND I ENCOURAGE ALL OF YOU– THIS IS THE BEGINNING OF, I HOPE, A THOUGHTFUL STATEMENT OF THE MAIN CHALLENGES AND PROBLEMS. AND WE CAN COUPLE IT WITH SOME OF THE GOOD IDEAS THAT WE’VE HEARD ON HOW WE MODEL THE PRACTICE OF THE BEST HIGH ACHIEVING STATES, IN TERMS OF WHERE WE GO FROM HERE, AND AGAIN, ENCOURAGE ACTION, DISCUSSION, DEBATE, AND ATTENTION TO THESE OVER THE MONTHS AND YEAR AHEAD. SO I WOULD INVITE COMMENTS ON HOW THIS ARTICULATES AND HOW ANY REMAINING PROBLEMS COULD BE IMPROVED, BUT ALSO I HOPE THAT WE COULD RECEIVE THIS REPORT OR STATEMENT, AND THEN NEXT MONTH, WE’LL COUPLE IT WITH SOME IDEAS OF WHAT THE FIXES ARE TO THESE PROBLEMS THAT WE CAN ALSO DISCUSS. SO THANKS, EVERYBODY, TOO, FOR PARTICIPATING IN THIS EXAMINATION AND WHAT IS AND WILL CONTINUE TO BE, AS WE CONSTRUCTIVELY WRESTLE WITH AN IMPORTANT PRIORITY FOR US AS A STATE AND AS A BOARD.>>DO YOU WANT US TO START WITH A MOTION FIRST? AND THEN–>>SURE.>>CAN YOU GO INTO THE REGULAR MEETING? YOU’RE IN COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE RIGHT NOW.>>OH.>>DIDN’T I CALL THE–>>WELL, I’LL GO BACK. IT’S LISTED AS COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE THESE LAST TWO DISCUSSION ITEMS.>>OH, OKAY.>>CAN WE DO IT?>>YES.>>MR. CHAIR.>>YES, SIR. MOVED BY JOHN, SUPPORTED BY CASANDRA. ALL IN FAVOR, AYE.>>all: AYE.>>OPPOSED, SAME. I THINK I COULD’VE JUST DONE THAT, ACTUALLY, BUT WE’RE BACK.>>THANK YOU, JOHN.>>NOW WE’RE BACK IN–>>THANK YOU.>>WE’RE MOVING– NOW WE’RE IN THE– WE’RE IN THE REGULAR MEETING. SO I WAS JUST GOING TO INVITE A MOTION TO RECEIVE THE REPORT AND HAVE SOME MORE DISCUSSION ABOUT IT. WE CAN KEEP IMPROVING IT AS WE ADD THE RECOMMENDATIONS FOR CHANGE.>>I WOULD MOVE THAT WE RECEIVE THE REPORT AND–>>IT’S MOVED BY CASANDRA, SUPPORTED BY– WAS THAT KATHLEEN? ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION TODAY? ALL IN FAVOR, AYE.>>all: AYE.>>OPPOSED, SAME.>>LET’S DISCUSS THIS MORE, WITH RECOMMENDATIONS FOR NEXT TIME. OKAY.>>SO ARE WE READY FOR RECOMMENDATIONS? OR ARE WE STILL VOTING?>>WELL, I–>>THE MOTION WAS SIMPLY TO RECEIVE THE REPORT.>>AND THEN DISCUSSION CAN ENSUE. THIS IS JUST RECEIVING IT.>>I ACTUALLY THOUGHT THAT WAS A NICE THING TO DO TODAY, BUT WE CAN TALK ABOUT IT MORE TODAY, OR IF IT’S THE WILL OF THE GROUP, WE CAN TALK ABOUT IT ALL MORE NEXT MONTH, BUT I WAS NOT TRYING TO DISCOURAGE THE DISCUSSION. I WAS JUST SAYING THAT LET’S RECEIVE THE REPORT, AND–>>YES, IF I COULD JUST ADD ONE THING.>>FROM THE CHAIR’S POINT OF VIEW, AS A PROCESS ISSUE, RECEIVING IT DOESN’T MEAN ENDORSING ALL THE RECOMMENDATIONS. THAT WOULD BE SOMETHING THAT WOULD HAVE TO HAVE ANOTHER MOTION.>>SO DO WE NEED A MOTION TO DISCUSS?>>SURE– YOU DON’T NEED A MOTION TO DISCUSS. YOU’RE WELCOME TO DISCUSS.>>OKAY. IF I CAN OFFER, FIRST OF ALL, JOHN, YOU’VE BEEN VERY RECEPTIVE TO THE COMMENTS THAT I SENT YOU A COUPLE WEEKS AGO. I SEE MOST OF THEM INCLUDED. THE CONTEXT OF THE– THIS HAS COME A LONG WAY SINCE THE ORIGINAL HEARINGS WERE HELD, BECAUSE IN THOSE, WE DIDN’T REALLY PROBE AT ALL SCHOOLS BEATING THE ODDS. WE JUST DIDN’T DISCUSS IT. IT WAS MAINLY A FINANCIAL REPORT, AND ACADEMIC FINANCIALS. THERE WERE OUTSIDE CONTEXTS GIVEN IN THE HEARINGS, BUT NOT– WE DIDN’T DELVE INTO FLORIDA’S HISPANIC KIDS READING BETTER THAN OUR WHITE KIDS RIGHT NOW ON THE NAEP. SO I APPRECIATE YOU INCLUDED THOSE THINGS. I THINK THAT THERE ARE STILL SOME MORE STATISTICS THAT WOULD BE IMPORTANT TO OPEN UP THE CONVERSATION WITH THE LEGISLATURE. I JUST FORWARDED YOU SOME. AS IT READS RIGHT NOW, IT’S STILL SHIFTED TOWARD MONEY BEING THE ONLY REASON THESE THINGS AREN’T WORKING, AS OPPOSED TO– I SEE CONDITIONS, FOR EXAMPLE, WE DON’T HAVE ANY CASE LISTING COORDINATING MECHANISM. SO WE CAN’T REALLY– EVERY SINGLE COLLEGE BOARD IS INDEPENDENT. SO THERE’S A LIMIT TO WHAT THE DEPARTMENT CAN DO TO DERIVE BETTER TEACHER QUALITY SO THAT THE NEW TEACHERS COMING IN ARE BETTER PREPARED FOR OUR SCHOOLS. AND WE KNOW THAT’S AN ISSUE, SO NOT HAVING THIS IN HERE SLANTS– IT’S SORT OF LIKE A LACK OF INFORMATION THEN PUSHES THIS TO BE SOMETHING THAT IS A FINANCIAL REPORT. AND I’M VERY CONCERNED ABOUT THAT, BECAUSE OF THE CONTEXT. THINGS LIKE MORE FUNDING– HOW DO YOU ACTUALLY DIRECT FUNDING SO THAT IT LEADS TO STUDENT OUTCOME AS OPPOSED TO SOME OTHER EXPENDITURE LIKE FOR A FOOTBALL FIELD OR SOMETHING ELSE? IT DOESN’T WORK, AND WE KNOW THESE ARE PROBLEMS. WE’VE TALKED ABOUT THEM ON A BIPARTISAN BASIS. SO TO ME, IF YOU’RE GOING TO ASK FOR MORE FUNDING, WHETHER IT’S PROGRESSIVE FUNDING TO TRY AND LEAD TOWARD SPECIFIC OUTCOMES FOR SPECIFIC GROUPS OF STUDENTS, OR AN INCREASE IN FUNDING, WHICH IS CERTAINLY THE IMPORTANT MESSAGE IN MY EYES, WHAT I’M MISSING IN THIS IS THE RESTRICTIONS IN A LOCAL CONTROL STATE WITHOUT K-16 COORDINATION THAT ALLOW THINGS TO GO OFF COURSE FOR STUDENT OUTCOME. WHEN YOU LOOK AT US BEING 8th PER CAPITA IN FUNDING, 1st, POTENTIALLY, IN THE COUNTRY, AT LEAST ACCORDING TO ONE REPORT IN TEACHER SALARIES, ADJUSTED PER CAPITA, AND 37th, 38th, 39th ON NAEP– IS IT MONEY, OR IS IT DIRECTION AND COORDINATION? IS IT BOTH? SO TO GET TO THE WHOLE DISCUSSION, YOU HAVE TO INCLUDE THE PARAMETERS THAT ARE IMPACTING WHY THINGS GO WRONG, NOT JUST MONEY. AND THAT’S THE PART THAT I’M MISSING. IT TOOK A WHILE TO PICK IT UP, BECAUSE I KEPT ON SAYING, “OKAY, FINE. WHAT STATISTICS DO I KNOW THAT WOULD SHIFT THIS?” AND I SENT YOU AN EMAIL SAYING I’M NOT SURE I ARTICULATED ALL OF THEM, BUT I’M SURE THE BOARD COULD THINK THROUGH THE THINGS WE’VE HEARD THE LAST FEW YEARS.>>I’M WONDERING IF– BECAUSE I THINK THIS WAS REALLY DIVIDED INTO TWO SECTIONS, RIGHT? SO THIS IS THE FIRST ONE, JUST SAYING, “WE HAVE A PROBLEM.” AND THEN THE SECOND ONE IS THE SOLUTIONS. I’M WONDERING IF THAT MIGHT BE MORE IN THE SOLUTIONS PART OF IT?>>I THINK IT’S HERE TOO, BECAUSE IT’S VERY ARTICULATE ON THE FINANCIAL SIDE IN THIS REPORT OF THE THINGS THAT ARE WRONG. AND WHAT I’M TALKING ABOUT ARE THE STRUCTURAL THINGS THAT WE KNOW AREN’T WORKING. THE SOLUTIONS WILL COME LATER.>>THEY NEED TO FALL IN BOTH CATEGORIES, TOO.>>EXACTLY.>>IF YOU HAVE PARTICULAR STRATEGIES YOU THINK ARE PART OF THE SOLUTION TO THE PROBLEMS, AS WELL AS– I THINK, AS YOU CAN SEE, WE’RE TRYING TO ACKNOWLEDGE HONESTLY, AND IF WE ALL COME TO AGREE, THAT’S WONDERFUL. BUT THERE’S A FEW– THERE’S A NUMBER OF MAJOR DRIVERS OF OUR POOR PERFORMANCE THAT ARE FINANCIAL AND SCHOOL ORGANIZATION IN NATURE, INCLUDING SMART AND STRATEGIC INVESTMENT VERSUS NON, AT WHATEVER LEVEL MONEY, AND THE TOUGHER NUTS ARE WHAT IS THE OVERALL LEVEL OF EFFORT, AND AGREEING THAT THERE’S SOME BETTER APPROACH TO CHOICE, CHARTER, AND KIND OF SCHOOL ORGANIZATION STRATEGY THAN THE KIND OF INCHOATE SYSTEM OR NON-STRATEGY THAT WE HAVE. AND THOSE ARE TOUGH THINGS TO TALK ABOUT IN TERMS OF SOLUTIONS. IF WE CAN ACTUALLY NAME THEM AS CHALLENGES, IT HELPS US ALONG THE WAY TO SAY THAT THESE ARE REAL PROBLEMS.>>I THINK IT WOULD DIFFERENTIATE THE REPORT FROM BEING A PARTISAN REPORT, WHICH IT CERTAINLY WAS BEFORE THE ELECTION, TO BEING A GENUINE, THOUGHTFUL– REPUBLICANS AND DEMOCRATS, IT’S GOING TO TAKE ALL OF US TO PULL TOGETHER TO SOLVE THIS. WE CERTAINLY HEARD WHEN MSU CONVENED THE MASSACHUSETTS FOLKS AND OTHERS THAT IT TOOK A COMMISSION STARTED BY A REPUBLICAN AND A DEMOCRAT TO DRIVE THE CONVERSATION FOR THIS, AND IT WAS BUSINESS BASED. IT WAS BUSINESS ARTICULATED AND BUSINESS BASED. SO I’M ANXIOUS TO ENSURE THAT ANY REPORT THAT COMES OUT OF THIS IS BIPARTISAN, AND IS RESPONSIBLE FOR ALL OF THE ASPECTS, WHETHER WE CAN COME UP WITH SOLUTIONS TO ALL OF IT OR NOT. I DON’T THINK WE CAN FOR LOCAL CONTROL. WE CAN’T– I DON’T KNOW HOW THE LEGISLATURE WOULD DRIVE FUNDING THAT’S BASED FOR STUDENT OUTCOME IN A WAY THAT AFFECTS STUDENT OUTCOME.>>AND I CERTAINLY SHARE YOUR– WE WILL BE MORE EFFECTIVE, MOST EFFECTIVE IF WE CAN FORCE THAT COMING TOGETHER AND FORGE HARMONY BETWEEN WHAT THE BUSINESS LEADERSHIP AND OTHERS ARE POINTING TO AS CHALLENGES AND AS OVERARCHING SOLUTIONS.>>SO–>>OTHER COMMENTS? YES, MA’AM.>>SO THEN, HOW DO WE INCORPORATE WHAT EILEEN IS TRYING TO CONVEY TO TAKE CARE OF THE RECOMMENDATIONS SHE’S MAKING?>>WELL, SHE’S– I’M LISTENING, AND I’LL LISTEN MORE, AND WE CAN ALL LISTEN, SO WE’LL TRY TO TAKE ADDITIONAL COMMENTS, ANY THAT PEOPLE WANT TO MAKE TODAY, ABOUT EITHER AFFIRMATIONS OF GOOD DIRECTIONS THAT ARE IN HERE, OR ANY PARTICULAR THINGS THEY WOULD LIKE TO SEE ENHANCED JUST ON THE PROBLEM STATEMENT, AND ALSO INCORPORATE THAT WITH THE BEGINNING, AN EVOLVED DRAFT OF RECOMMENDATIONS THAT MEETS THOSE CHALLENGES THAT WILL CIRCULATE SOON, AND HAVE A– WE WON’T DO IT IN PRIVATE– HAVE A GOOD PUBLIC DISCUSSION ABOUT THAT AT OUR NEXT MEETING. YES, SIR.>>YEAH, RICHARD, THEN KATHLEEN.>>THERE’S A LOT OF HELPFUL THINGS IN THIS REPORT. A LOT OF GOOD CONCESSIONS, I THINK, WHICH MAKE IT A MUCH MORE BALANCED– MY PROBLEM, THOUGH, IS WITH THE PREMISE. THE BROAD AGREEMENT THAT THE SYSTEM ORGANIZED IN MICHIGAN IS IN NEED OF FUNDAMENTAL CHANGE. I’M NOT SURE THAT WE’RE IN NEED OF FUNDAMENTAL CHANGE. THE EDUCATION SYSTEM IS LIKE AN AUTOMOBILE. GASOLINE IS ABSOLUTELY ESSENTIAL, JUST AS MONEY IS ABSOLUTELY ESSENTIAL, BUT IF YOU’RE STUCK IN THE SNOW, BRINGING MORE GASOLINE ISN’T GOING TO HELP THAT PROBLEM AT ALL. AND SOME OF OUR PROBLEMS IN EDUCATION IS OF THE STUCK IN THE SNOW VARIETY. NOW, WE NEED TO ENSURE A CONTINUOUS AND ADEQUATE SUPPLY OF GASOLINE, THAT IS, AN ADEQUATE SUPPLY OF FUNDING, BUT I DON’T ACCEPT THE PREMISE THAT OUR EDUCATIONAL FAILURES ARE PRIMARILY DUE TO FUNDING PROBLEMS. SO WHILE I’M WILLING TO LOOK AT– AND THERE ARE MANY GOOD SUGGESTIONS HERE FOR TINKERING WITH THE FUNDING FORMULA– IT MAKES SENSE THAT IT COSTS MORE TO EDUCATE A HIGH SCHOOL STUDENT THAN AN ELEMENTARY STUDENT. IT MAKES SENSE TO CHANGE THAT FORMULA. IT MIGHT MAKE SENSE TO OFFER COMPENSATORY SERVICES FOR CERTAIN IDENTIFIABLE CATEGORIES OF NEED, BUT WE MUST NOT FALL INTO THE ERROR OF THINKING THAT MONEY CAN COMPENSATE FOR WHAT’S MISSING IN THE FAMILY, OR THAT MONEY CAN ERASE OR SUDDENLY CAUSE ALL OUR STUDENTS TO PERFORM WITHIN THE SAME PERCENTILE.>>I DO WANT TO HEAR EVERYBODY’S PERSPECTIVE. I JUST, IN RESPONSE, I FEEL LIKE THE BROAD SENSE I’M HEARING FROM PEOPLE IS THAT IN PARTICULAR, OTHER STATES HAVE DESIGNED AND ENGINEERED JUST A NEWER MODEL. THEY’RE DRIVING F-150 ALUMINUM, WHICH GOES FURTHER FASTER AND CHEAPER, WHILE WE’RE STILL DRIVING A WONDERFUL T-BIRD THAT WE LOVE, BUT IS NOT– IS JUST DESIGNED AND ENGINEERED NOT TO DO AS WELL WITH THE MONEY WE PUT IN IT. SO WE DO NEED AN OVERHAUL IN MY VIEW, AND I THINK THERE’S A BROAD SENSATION FROM THE FIELD THAT IT’S TIME TO OVERHAUL, ALA PROPOSAL A, THE WAY WE FINANCE AND ORGANIZE EDUCATION TO GET BETTER OUTCOMES. THAT’S CERTAINLY WHAT I AM FEELING AND ENCOURAGING US TO ARTICULATE, BUT I APPRECIATE YOUR POINT OF VIEW. IT’S NOT JUST ABOUT PUTTING MORE MONEY IN THE TANK. IT’S A DESIGN ENGINEERING CHANGE IN HOW WE RUN THIS– YOU’RE ALWAYS GOOD ABOUT SAYING IT’S HOW WE DO EDUCATIONAL POLICY, HOW WE RUN AN EDUCATIONAL EFFORT, NOT JUST ABOUT SCHOOLS. IT’S ABOUT HOW WE DESIGN AND ENGINEER THE WAY WE DELIVER EDUCATION.>>KATHLEEN.>>WELL, THERE ARE A LOT OF GOOD THINGS IN HERE. I TOLD JOHN HE’S VERY GOOD AT THIS PULLING IT ALL TOGETHER. BUT WE RECEIVED A LETTER FROM THE SUPERINTENDENT OF KALAMAZOO PUBLIC SCHOOLS, WITH WHICH I AGREE COMPLETELY, AND I THINK HE’S ABSOLUTELY RIGHT. WE HAVE TO PUT SOME REFERENCE TO THAT IN THE RECOMMENDATIONS. WE HAVE SOME THINGS IN HERE ABOUT SCHOOL FINANCE REFORM, BUT THAT’S A VERY IMPORTANT ONE.>>WELL, THEIR LETTER I KNOW RICHARD SENT AN EMAIL BACK, NOT DISAGREEING WITH THAT LETTER, BUT I THINK THE POINT THAT WAS MADE, AND I’M NOT SURE BECAUSE THIS IS A LETTER THAT I HAVEN’T SEEN, IS BASICALLY ARGUING FOR SOME VERSION OF DIFFERENTIAL FUNDING, WHICH IS ONE OF THE FEATURES, I THINK, OF WHAT BEST STATES DO, WHICH OUR WELL-INTENTIONED FOUNDATION GRANT HAS NOW GOTTEN– CREATED ALL THESE PERVERSE, UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES AND IS NOT ATTENTIVE TO EQUAL OPPORTUNITY TO GET THE OUTCOMES THAT OTHER STATES AND DIFFERENTIAL FUNDING– EVEN AS YOU RAISED THIS MORNING, DAN, IN THE SPECIAL EDUCATION CONTEXT. I THINK THAT’S A PIECE OF OUR RECOMMENDATION FOR SURE, AT LEAST I WILL CERTAINLY ENCOURAGE IT, AND WHAT THAT– THE MASSACHUSETTS MODEL, AND I KEEP COMING BACK TO THAT THAT EILEEN FLAGGED– THEY FIGURED OUT THEY NEEDED SOME DIFFERENTIAL FUNDING. THAT’S NOT EASY TO PUT IN PLACE. HOW DO YOU DELIVER A SYSTEM THAT ATTENDS TO BOTH COST AND PERFORMANCE– YOU KNOW, DIFFERENTIAL MONEY TO GET DIFFERENTIAL PERFORMANCE– BUT THEY DID HAVE A SHORT– NOT FOREVER– TASK FORCE OF EDUCATORS, CONSULTANTS AND PROFESSIONALS WHO DESIGNED THEIR DIFFERENTIATED FUNDING MODEL. AND IT DIDN’T TAKE THEM 2 YEARS. IT TOOK THEM 6 MONTHS. AND MY ENCOURAGEMENT WOULD BE THAT WE NEED TO BE CALLING FOR SOME SIMILAR EFFORT, WHERE WE ENCOURAGE A DIFFERENTIAL FUNDING SYSTEM AND SET SOME PEOPLE TO DESIGN IT, BUT NOT TO TAKE 2 OR 3 YEARS OR SOME NOTION OF AN ADEQUACY STUDY THAT’S GOING TO TAKE FOREVER TO DO. BUT THAT’S– I’M GETTING AHEAD OF OURSELVES HERE.>>WELL, YOU KNOW, YEARS AGO, 35 YEARS AGO, I WAS PART OF THE STAFF FOR THIS SENATE EDUCATION COMMITTEE, AND WE DID COME UP WITH A WEIGHTED– WE CALLED IT A WEIGHTED PUPIL FORMULA IN THOSE DAYS. DIFFERENTIAL FUNDING. IT PASSED THE HOUSE BUT COULDN’T GET THROUGH THE SENATE IN THOSE DAYS. OR MAYBE WE PASSED THE SENATE AND COULDN’T GET THROUGH THE HOUSE. WE GOT THROUGH ONE OF THEM. IT’S AN OLD IDEA, AND I THINK IT’S WORTHY OF BEING REVIVED, MAYBE WITH DIFFERENT WEIGHTS… [ INDISTINCT ]>>CAN I JUST MENTION ON THAT–>>THAT’S ONE OF THE THINGS I THINK WE HAVE TO PUT INTO THIS.>>AND WE GET A LOT OF LETTERS FROM A LOT OF PEOPLE, SO I JUST WANT TO BE RESPECTFUL. THERE’S LOTS OF DIFFERENT POINTS OF VIEW ON WHAT WE SHOULD DO. THAT LETTER REINFORCED THAT NOTION, AND THERE ARE MANY DIFFERENT IDEAS THAT WE HEARD THAT WE NEED TO WRESTLE WITH.>>I KNOW WE GOT A LOT OF INPUT, WHICH WAS VERY GOOD. AND YOU INCORPORATED A LOT OF THAT IN YOUR– BUT I’VE BEEN SAYING THIS, MAYBE NOT AS ELOQUENTLY AS DR. WEISS DID, BUT I’VE BEEN REPEATING THE QUOTE FOR A LONG TIME: “EQUAL OPPORTUNITY MEANS UNEQUAL FUNDING.” EVEN IF WE PUT MORE MONEY INTO THE MIX, WHICH IS WHAT HAS BEEN SAID IN A COUPLE PAGES.>>I’LL JUST MENTION TO THAT POINT, WHILE YOU’RE TALKING ABOUT THAT, THAT WE– AS YOU KNOW, WE, THROUGH ME AND THE DEPARTMENT, HAVE ADVOCATED FOR, AT LEAST WITHIN THE EXISTING SYSTEM, SIGNIFICANTLY MORE MONEY IN AT-RISK. I WOULD PREFER WHAT JOHN’S DESCRIBED, WHICH IS A MORE NUANCED, MASSACHUSETTS-LIKE WAY, BUT THERE’S REALITIES THAT OUR GUYS WOULD HAVE TO CARRY OUT. SO I OFFER THIS VERY MUCH IN GOOD FAITH THAT WE’RE GOING TO TRY TO CARRY OUT WHATEVER THE BOARD OF ED COMES UP WITH. THERE’S CERTAIN REALITIES ACROSS THE STREET OF THE ELECTION HAVING CONSEQUENCES. SO PART OF THAT WOULD BE AT LEAST A BACKUP PLAN TO BE THOUGHTFUL ABOUT WITH SOME OF THE OTHER CONSIDERATIONS ABOUT AT-RISK, BECAUSE IT IS A POSSIBLE VEHICLE FOR TWO THINGS: FOR PUTTING MONEY INTO WHERE RURAL, AND URBAN IN PARTICULAR, BUT PRETTY MUCH ACROSS THE BOARD, MOST DISTRICTS HAVE SOME AT-RISK KIDS AND WOULD GET SUPPLEMENTED FOR THAT. AND THEN TO JOHN’S POINT, MAYBE ATTACH SOME METRICS OR RESULTS TO THAT, IF THAT’S WHAT WOULD HELP GET FOLKS ON BOARD, FOLKS THAT MIGHT NOT BE QUICK TO JUMP AT THAT. AND I ALSO WANT TO SAY THAT THE IDEAL MIGHT NOT BE ACHIEVABLE. THAT’S WHY I’M THINKING ABOUT THIS TWO-PRONGED EVENT THAT I WOULD RECOMMEND TO THE BOARD. THINK ABOUT WHAT’S IDEAL, AND THEN ALSO THINK ABOUT WHAT YOU WANT US TO GO ACROSS THE STREET AND TRY TO MAKE HAPPEN. AND THEY MAY BE A BIT DIFFERENT, BUT I DO THINK THAT THERE’S AN OPENNESS– I DON’T WANT TO SPEAK FOR THE GOVERNOR, AND BEFORE HIS BUDGET’S OUT, I’M NOT GOING TO PUT CRAIG ON THE SPOT EITHER. BUT I WOULD JUST SAY THAT CRAIG AND I HAVE HAD GOOD DISCUSSIONS ABOUT THE NEED FOR THAT, BECAUSE NOT ONLY DOES THAT AT-RISK FUNDING GET TO KIDS WHO ACTUALLY HAVE MORE NEEDS AND NEED MORE SUPPLEMENTARY HELP, BUT IT ALSO KIND OF AT THE SAME TIME KILLS ANOTHER BIRD, WHICH IS THAT OFTENTIMES THOSE ARE THE DISTRICTS THAT ARE IN DEFICIT PROBLEMS. SO YOU COULD POSSIBLY KILL TWO BIRDS WITH ONE STONE WITHIN THE SAME FINANCE STRUCTURE WE HAVE IF WE’RE NOT ABLE TO GET TO– BUT I AGREE WITH JOHN. THIS COULD BE DONE IN 6 MONTHS IF THERE’S A POLITICAL WILL. JUST A THOUGHT ON THAT POINT.>>WELL, HE EMPHASIZED THE EFFECTS OF POVERTY, AND WE’VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT THAT OURSELVES. SO THAT’S REALLY THE BASIS OF IT. WE HAVE TO ACCOUNT FOR THE EFFECT OF POVERTY.>>RIGHT. AND I THINK, TO EILEEN’S POINT, WE COULD ADD SOME VALUE TO THIS OF WHAT WE’VE LEARNED FROM SCHOOLS WITH EVEN LACKING FUNDING THAT HAVE MOVED THE BALL ON STUDENT ACHIEVEMENT, AND THEN MAYBE SAY THAT THOSE ARE REQUIREMENTS OF THE TARGETED MONEY, AS JOHN’S SAYING, IN ORDER TO RECEIVE THAT MONEY. IN OTHER WORDS, WE ALREADY KNOW THROUGH OUR BODY OF WORK THAT OF THE SO-CALLED BOTTOM 5%, 180 OF THEM HAVE GONE THIS WAY, AND HERE’S HOW THEY’VE USED THEIR RESOURCES. THEN MAYBE THAT BECOMES PART OF THE DISCUSSION ON–>>–HUMAN RESOURCES COULD BE VERY IMPORTANT.>>RESOURCES AND THEN HOW WE THINK IT’S BEEN SHOWN CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE ON STUDENT ACHIEVEMENT, AS OPPOSED TO JUST THE RESOURCES AND USING THEM AS YOU SEE FIT. I THINK EILEEN WAS NEXT, AND THEN MICHELLE.>>I JUST WANT TO ADD ON IN ADDITION TO THE REALITIES OF ACROSS THE STREET POLITICALLY, THE REALITIES ECONOMICALLY ARE HUGE, BECAUSE THERE’S JUST BEEN A SETTLEMENT WITH IBM THIS SUMMER, THAT I UNDERSTAND IS SOMEPLACE BETWEEN HALF A BILLION AND A BILLION DOLLARS OF LAWSUIT REVENUES, I DON’T KNOW OVER WHAT TIME PERIOD. SO PUTTING THE STRUCTURE TOGETHER FOR THIS MAY HAVE TO PRECEDE MONEY, BECAUSE I DON’T KNOW WHAT THE POOL IS AVAILABLE. I JUST KNOW THAT YOU CITED IT IN YOUR EMAIL YESTERDAY, AND I KNOW IT’S REAL.>>NO, THAT’S A GOOD POINT. WE HAVE ONGOING PLANS OURSELVES IN THAT RESPECT, BECAUSE I THINK WE– WITH A LITTLE LUCK, I THINK IT’LL BE EXTENDED OVER TIME, BUT WITH THE SUPREME COURT NOT WILLING TO HEAR IT, WE’LL SEE WHAT’S COMING. MICHELLE, PLEASE.>>YEAH, I’M JUST WONDERING. THERE WAS SOME DISCUSSION ABOUT WANTING TO LOOK AT WHERE WE’RE GOING, WHERE WE ARE, AND FIGURING OUT A BUDGET FOR HOW TO GET THERE, AS A WAY OF LOOKING AT FINANCE. AND I– SO I SEE THERE’S BUDGETING BASED ON THE NEED OF THE CHILD OR THE DISTRICT, SO IS THAT– SORT OF– ARE YOU TRYING TO GET TO THE SAME THING? LIKE WE’RE LOOKING– AND I CAN’T REMEMBER WHO THE SPEAKER WAS, BUT IT SEEMED TO MAKE GREAT SENSE, AND I’M TOLD THAT THIS IS SORT OF THE PLAN USED IN MASSACHUSETTS, WHERE YOU LOOK AT WHAT YOU WANT, YOU SEE WHERE YOU ARE, AND THEN FIGURE OUT HOW MUCH IT COSTS TO GET THERE, AND YOU ENSURE THAT YOU HAVE THAT ALLOCATION THERE. SO IT’S– AND I DON’T KNOW IF THAT’S– THAT COULD BE–>>JUST THAT SOME SORT OF– THE PROCESS THAT MASSACHUSETTS DID IN DESIGNING IN A DIFFERENTIAL FUNDING FORMULA THAT REFLECTED DIFFERENCES IN COSTS AND IN HOW MUCH MONEY WAS NEEDED TO GET CERTAIN OUTCOMES. THAT’S WHAT THEY DID, WAS THEY CHARGED A PROCESS TO FOLKS WHO WERE INVOLVED AND INFORMED ABOUT EDUCATION, TO SAY, “WILL YOU FIGURE THIS OUT, PLEASE?” AND THEN THEY CAME UP WITH– YOU KNOW, ANY FORMULA IS GOING TO BE SOMEWHAT ARBITRARY, BUT HAVING THE FOLKS WHO DO THE WORK DESIGN THE SYSTEM, TO THINK WHAT WOULD YOU NEED TO GET THE KINDS OF OUTCOMES WE’RE TALKING ABOUT? AND HOW WOULD YOU CREATE A FUNDING SYSTEM? AND THAT’S WHAT THEY DID. WE MIGHT WANT TO ENCOURAGE A SIMILAR PROCESS, IF WE’RE RECOMMENDING DIFFERENTIAL FUNDING, BUT I APPRECIATE THAT THERE’S CERTAINLY INCREMENTAL WAYS TO GET MORE OF THE GOOD, SOME DIFFERENTIAL SUPPORT, TO HELP GET BETTER OUTCOMES BASED ON SOME NEED FOR DIFFERENT SUPPORT.>>AND I ALSO SHARE EILEEN’S CONCERN ABOUT THIS REVENUE STREAM GOING INTO THE EDUCATION FUNDING AND I’M FEARFUL THAT– I’M TOLD THAT ONE OF THE OPTIONS– AND I KEEP BRINGING THIS UP– FOR TRANSPORTATION WOULD REMOVE SALES TAX MONEY THAT IS NOW DEDICATED TO EDUCATION. AND I WORRY ABOUT THAT AS WELL AS THE MONEY THAT WENT FROM PERSONAL PROPERTY TAXES AND MICHIGAN BUSINESS TAX BEING TAKEN FROM THE REVENUE STREAM INTO EDUCATION, SO WHAT WE DO IS CUT OFF THE FUNDING AND THEN SAY, “WELL, LET’S SEE HOW MUCH WE’VE GOT AND WHAT WE CAN DO WITH THAT,” AND “THIS TOWN HAS ALWAYS GOTTEN MORE FOR THEIR KIDS, SO WE’RE GOING TO GIVE THEM MORE,” SO I’M WORRIED ABOUT HOW WE COULD FIX THAT.>>WELL, IN ADDITION TO HOW LOCALS COULD SOMEHOW INCREASE THEIR EFFORT RELATIVE TO WHATEVER THE STATE DID, IN ADDITION TO WHAT THE STATE DID, I THINK WE MY SAY SOMETHING ABOUT WAYS TO POSSIBLY GET CLOSER TO THE ORIGINAL PROPOSAL A HOPE, WHICH WAS, IN PART, WE WANT A DURABLE, PROTECTED, SORT OF THERE IN GOOD TIMES AND BAD, POT OF MONEY FOR K-12. AND THEY HOPED TO DESIGN SOMETHING LIKE THAT, AND IT’S BEEN COMPROMISED IN SOME WAYS, BECAUSE MONEY’S BEING USED FOR OTHER PURPOSES, AND IT HASN’T BEEN BOTH AS DURABLE AND SORT OF THE LEVEL OF EFFORT AS WAS HOPED. SO SOMETHING TO SAY ABOUT OVERALL LEVEL OF EFFORT AND HOW YOU ENSURE SOME CONTINUITY AND SOME PROTECTION OF WHAT WE’RE WANTING TO PUT INTO K-12, WHATEVER THAT IS, MIGHT BE SOMETHING THAT WE SHOULD SPEAK TO, AND HOW WE DESIGN A SYSTEM THAT SPENDS MONEY SMARTER OR DIFFERENTLY TO GET TO BETTER OUTCOMES IS ANOTHER COMPONENT.>>AND MICHELLE, I– WATCHING 20 YEARS CLOSELY OF THE EDUCATION LOBBY, I HAVE GREAT CONFIDENCE THAT THEY COULD STOP A MOVE TO TRY TO TAKE SOME OF THAT REVENUE IN A DIFFERENT DIRECTION. HAVING SAID THAT, I ALSO HAVE GREAT CONFIDENCE BECAUSE I’VE ADDRESSED IT WITH HIM IN SPEECHES AND A COUPLE OF THE ED ALLIANCE MEETINGS THAT, “WILL YOU BE OPEN TO DIFFERENTIATED FUNDING?” BECAUSE SOME OF YOU WOULD NEED TO STAND UP TO YOUR OWN MEMBERS, WHO WOULD SAY IT’S EVEN ACROSS THE BOARD. SO I MEAN, ONE REASON– I’M TALKING ABOUT MYSELF AS STATE SUP, ANYWAY– HAVE TRIED TO USE THE THEME OF AT-RISK, WHETHER IT ENDED UP WITH THAT OR NOT, IN THAT, YOU KNOW, TEST YOURSELVES NOW. WHEN YOU GO BACK TO YOUR SUPS, TEACHERS, WHATEVER, CAN YOU HELP SELL THE IDEA THAT THERE IS A RELATIONSHIP HERE, AND IF SO, THAT YOU DON’T GO BACK AND IN THE BACK ROOMS OF THE LOBBY, SAY, “IT’S GOT TO ALL BE EVEN.” AND THAT’S JUST A– I’M JUST PUTTING IT ON THE TABLE– A FORCE THAT IS NOT– WITH NO MALICE– IS NOT EASY TO PERSUADE ITS MEMBERS, WHERE THE MAJORITY WOULD NOT BE FAVORED BY THAT. SO THAT’S SOMETHING TO THINK ABOUT, JUST HOW DO WE BRING THEM IN AND TRY TO MAKE THEM UNDERSTAND THAT THAT’S THE ONLY WAY WE’RE GOING TO BE ABLE TO HELP THE STATE MOVE THIS WAY, AND ALL OF THOSE ARGUMENTS. CRAIG, YOU WERE NEXT.>>GOOD JOB. HECK OF A LOT HARDER TO WRITE 4 PAGES THAN 40. YOU DID A GOOD JOB OF SYNTHESIS. THE ONE ISSUE, JOHN, IS THE TITLE. NOT TO BE A NITPICKER, BUT THERE REALLY IS NO DISCUSSION IN HERE ABOUT ORGANIZATION OF PUBLIC EDUCATION.>>WELL, THAT IS INTENDED TO REFER TO THE CHOICE, CHARTER, CYBER SCHOOL CREATION OR NON-CREATION SET OF ISSUES.>>BUT THE– AND I READ THAT, BUT IT’S FINANCIALLY RELATED. IT ISN’T– WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT CHARTERS AND CHOICE AND ENROLLMENT TRENDS, IN THAT SECTION, IT’S ALL ABOUT MONEY. RATHER THAN STUDENT ACHIEVEMENT OR STRUCTURAL CHANGES THAT HAVE BEEN IMPROVEMENTS OR HAVE BEEN COUNTERPRODUCTIVE. AND THOSE ARE THE KINDS OF THINGS THAT I ASSOCIATE WITH ORGANIZATION. IT’S STRUCTURE. IT’S CONSOLIDATION OR GREATER FRAGMENTATION.>>I THINK SOME OF THAT WILL COME IN THE NEXT REPORT, CORRECT?>>YES, CERTAINLY. BUT FROM THE BEGINNING OF THIS, WE SAID WE DIDN’T WANT IT TO TALK EXCLUSIVELY ABOUT SCHOOL FINANCING, “LET’S OVERHAUL OUR SCHOOL FINANCE SYSTEM,” BECAUSE THERE ARE LOTS OF ISSUES THAT HAVE TO DO WITH POLICIES AROUND, YES, THE STRUCTURE OF SCHOOLS AS WELL, BUT JUST THE GENERAL POLICY OF WHAT ARE THE CIRCUMSTANCES BY WHICH WE’RE ORGANIZING OUR SYSTEM OF EDUCATION, INCLUDING HOW MANY DISTRICTS DO WE HAVE, AND ARE WE CONSOLIDATING, AND WHAT’S OUR STRATEGY FOR NEW SCHOOLS, CHARTERS, CYBER– ALL OF THOSE AFFECT THE WAY OUR OUTCOMES AND PERFORMANCE ARE, AND ALL OF THEM HAVE FINANCIAL IMPLICATIONS, RIGHT?>>SURE.>>AND SO THE TWO ARE WORKING TOGETHER, THE KIND OF GENERAL ORGANIZATION OF OUR EDUCATIONAL SYSTEM AND LANDSCAPE, AND THE FINANCING THEREOF. BUT IF YOU JUST TALK ABOUT FINANCING, PEOPLE THINK YOU’RE TALKING ABOUT HOW MUCH MONEY WE’RE SPENDING AND WHERE WE’RE SPENDING IT.>>SO I SHOULD JUST STAY TUNED FOR THE SECOND? OKAY. STATION IDENTIFICATION.>>WE SHOULD SAY PUBLIC SCHOOL, TOO.>>WE’RE NOT TALKING ABOUT PRIVATE EDUCATION YET, I HOPE.>>–STRUCTURE INSTEAD OF ORGANIZATION, THEN. THAT MIGHT WORK.>>SO MORE TO COME. AND ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION TODAY? GOOD JOB, JOHN.>>BUT DOESN’T– DON’T WE HAVE TO VOTE ON A MOTION?>>I THINK WE ALREADY DID.>>WE DID. WE RECEIVED THE REPORT.>>YEAH, AND THEN FURTHER RECOMMENDATIONS–>>NO, AFTER THE DISCUSSION, BUT FIRST WE TOOK TWO VOTES?>>OH, NO. YOU– WELL, YOU VOTED ON RECEIVING THE REPORT, AND THEN THE DISCUSSION WAS TO LAY THE GROUNDWORK FOR POSSIBLE RECOMMENDATIONS THAT JOHN AND OTHERS WOULD WORK WITH.>>WHEN THE SECOND PART COMES IN, THEN WE’LL VOTE ON IT.>>OKAY.>>OKAY, JOHN AGAIN. STATE SUP SEARCH– SOUNDS LIKE–>>AS YOU KNOW, WE HAVE A SUPERINTENDENT SEARCH GOING ON.>>YEAH, I HEARD SOMETHING.>>IT SOUNDS LIKE, FROM TODAY, JUST IN TIME. [ LAUGHTER ]>>WELL, I’VE GOT SEVERAL THINGS I WANT TO SAY ABOUT THAT PROCESS, WHICH YOU ALL KNOW ABOUT IT, THE BOARD MEMBERS, BECAUSE YOU’VE BEEN HAPPILY PARTICIPATING IN IT. WE DID– AS YOU KNOW, WE DID RECEIVE A LOT OF INPUT FROM STAKEHOLDERS AND THE PUBLIC OVER THE SUMMER. WE DID HAVE SOME GOOD, QUALITY TIME TOGETHER TO PUT FORWARD AN ARTICULATION OF THE NATURE OF THE PERSON WE’RE LOOKING FOR AND THE ROLES AND RESPONSIBILITIES OF THAT PERSON, AND THE CRITERIA BY WHICH WE’RE GOING TO LOOK FOR A CANDIDATE. AND ALL OF THAT IS PUBLICLY AVAILABLE. WE HAVE NOW FINALLY IDENTIFIED A SEARCH FIRM, A VERY HIGH QUALITY ONE, RAY AND ASSOCIATES, TO ASSIST US IN THIS PROCESS. THE NEXT STEP IS TO– WE’RE MEETING THE COMMITTEE WITH OPEN INVITATION FOR EVERYBODY, AND EVERYBODY USUALLY COMES, TO MEET WITH THEM AND FORGE A FINAL CONTRACT AND PRUNE THEIR WORK PLAN JUST A BIT, BECAUSE THEY WERE PROPOSING TO DO SOME OF THE INPUTTING PROCESS THAT WE ALREADY DID. AND THEN WE’LL PROCEED TO SHAPE THE NEXT PHASE, WHICH IS THE PUBLIC OUTREACH, WHICH WE WANT TO DO VERY SMARTLY IN TERMS OF HOW PEOPLE ARE TREATED, HOW LONG THEY CAN BE CONFIDENTIAL, WITH THE ADVICE FROM THE AG’S. AS I SAID, WHAT’S IMPORTANT TO ME IS THAT WE HAVE A GOOD DEFINITION OF WHAT WE’RE LOOKING FOR. WE WANT AN EFFECTIVE LEADER WHO HAS AN EFFECTIVE TRACK RECORD AND AN EFFECTIVE STRATEGY AND SUBSTANTIVE GAMEPLAN FOR HOW WE IMPROVE EDUCATION THAT IS CONSONANT WITH THE BOARD AND HOW WE THINK WE CAN IMPROVE EDUCATION. I THINK IT’S VERY IMPORTANT BECAUSE SOME OF THE PEOPLE ARE GOING TO TRY TO PIT US ALL AGAINST EACH OTHER. WE’RE GOING TO KEEP WORKING TOGETHER ON A BIPARTISAN BASIS. WE’RE WORKING WITH CRAIG AND THE GOVERNOR, WHO’S PART OF THE STATE BOARD, EX OFFICIO. EAGER TO HAVE FULL COLLABORATION AND WORK TOGETHER ON THIS HUNT. WE ARE LOOKING FOR SOMEONE WHO FITS THAT BILL AND CAN HELP US IMPROVE EDUCATION. AND FROM MY POINT OF VIEW, WHICH I THINK WE ALL SHARE, WE WANT TO INVITE MICHIGAN LEADERS WHO HAVE GOOD RECORD, GOOD UNDERSTANDING, GOOD AGENDAS AND GOOD ABILITY TO IMPROVE EDUCATION TO PARTICIPATE. WE INVITE NATIONAL FOLKS AND WILL HAVE OUR FIRM LOOK BOTH STATEWIDE AND NATIONALLY FOR CANDIDATES. WE NOW KNOW WHO’S GOING TO BE ON THE BOARD. IT’S NOT GOING TO CHANGE. I THINK IT’S GOING TO STAY THE WAY IT IS FOR A WHILE.>>THERE’LL BE ONE CHANGE.>>EXCEPT FOR DAN. WE KNOW WHO WON THE ELECTION, SO THAT’S DONE, AND AGAIN, WE’RE NOT LOOKING FOR A DEMOCRAT OR A REPUBLICAN. WE’RE LOOKING FOR SOMEONE WHO CAN HELP US IMPROVE EDUCATION, WITH AN AGENDA THAT’S GOING TO BE EFFECTIVE IN THAT REGARD. AND I ALSO WANT TO MAKE CLEAR THAT THIS PERSON CAN BE AN ADVOCATE AND IN SUPPORT OF THAT AGENDA. WE DON’T HAVE A FAVORITE. I DON’T HAVE A FAVORITE. NO ONE IS A PRESUMPTIVE SELECTION HERE. I HOPE YOU ALL HAVE THAT SAME POINT OF VIEW. AND WHETHER YOU’RE CAMPAIGNING FOR THE JOB OR NOT CAMPAIGNING AND BEING PRIVATE, YOU’RE GOING TO BE TREATED AS FULLY AND SERIOUSLY, AND WE’RE GOING TO BE LOOKING FOR THE SAME STUFF AND CHECKING OUT WHETHER YOU’VE DONE WHAT YOU’VE SAID YOU’VE DONE, WHETHER YOU HAVE THE KIND OF ATTRIBUTES THAT WE’RE LOOKING FOR. AND SO THERE’S NO ADVANTAGE TO BEING A PUBLIC CAMPAIGNER OR A QUIET PARTICIPATOR IN THIS ELECTION PROCESS. WE’RE EAGER TO HAVE HIGH QUALITY PEOPLE, A NUMBER OF THEM, PARTICIPATE, BECAUSE WE VERY MUCH WANT TO FIND A WONDERFUL SUPERINTENDENT TO REPLACE OUR CURRENT WONDERFUL SUPERINTENDENT, AND THE DOOR IS WIDE OPEN. AND WE’RE GOING TO BE WORKING TOGETHER TO WORK THROUGH THIS PROCESS, I KNOW, VERY WELL TOGETHER TO MAKE AN EXCELLENT DECISION AND HAVE A BOARD THAT WORKS HAND IN GLOVE AND IS FULLY SUPPORTIVE OF THE PERSON WE HIRE. AND I KNOW THAT’S GOING TO BE THE CASE. YEAH.>>ARE WE ABLE TO– AND MY APOLOGIES, I MAY HAVE JUST MISSED THIS. ARE WE ABLE TO SIGNAL TO FOLKS AT ALL AT THIS POINT AS TO WHEN WE’D EXPECT THIS SEARCH TO BE OFFICIAL?>>THAT’S THE TEXT OF OUR MEETING NEXT WEEK, I THINK, WITH–>>TWENTY-FIFTH.>>THE 25th IS TO TRY TO SEE IF WE CAN PUT SOME PARAMETERS ON THAT. I ANTICIPATE THAT AS WE DID IN OUR GAME PLAN, AS SOON AS WE ENGAGE THE SEARCH FIRM, WITHIN SOME SHORT INTERVAL, TO PREPARE THAT ARTICULATION AND INVITATION TO CANDIDATES, THAT WE’LL OPEN A WINDOW OF SOME MONTH OR MONTHS TO INVITE PEOPLE, AND THAT THAT IS GOING TO UNFOLD REASONABLY SOON. SO, BUT EVERY STEP OF THE WAY, WE NEED TO KNOW WHAT WE’RE DOING AND MAKE SURE WE DO IT WELL.>>WE CAN, AT THIS POINT, SAFELY SAY THAT THAT WINDOW WOULD NOT OPEN UNTIL SOMETIME IN DECEMBER, IS THAT CORRECT?>>I THINK THAT’S FAIR ENOUGH, YEAH, BECAUSE IT’S–>>GIVEN THANKSGIVING.>>YEAH.>>RIGHT, OKAY.>>WHEN IS THE MEETING– OUR NEXT MEETING TO–>>IT LOOKS LIKE IT’S THE 25th AT 3:30. AND THAT WOULD BE ANOTHER PUBLIC MEETING.>>WHEN IS IT?>>3:30, HERE, WITH THE DTMB, RAY AND ASSOCIATES– WE AGREED LAST TIME THAT IT’S A COMMITTEE MEETING OF THE BOARD. I’VE ASKED CASANDRA AND EILEEN TO–>>WHAT’S THE DATE?>>THE 25th.>>THE 25th, 3:30. TWENTY-FIFTH. IT’S A TUESDAY.>>OKAY.>>SO WE DON’T NEED A QUORUM, BECAUSE IT’S THE COMMITTEE, SO WE DON’T HAVE THAT.>>WE SEEM TO LOVE HAVING QUORUMS. [ LAUGHTER ] WHICH IS A VERY HEALTHY THING. WE’RE JUST PUBLIC. WE’RE PUBLIC. MEETING PEOPLE, MAN. I’M THINKING WITH SUNSHINE, HERE. YEAH.>>I DID LIKE THAT.>>YEAH.>>ALL RIGHT, ANY OTHER QUESTIONS ABOUT THE SEARCH PROCESS?>>OKAY. AND I’M PRIVY TO KNOW THAT THERE’S A COUPLE OTHER VERY ATTRACTIVE JOBS OPENING UP AT EXACTLY THE SAME TIME, WHICH I THINK WILL PROBABLY HAVE SOME MEASURE OF WHAT YOUR POOL LOOKS LIKE. TIME WILL TELL THAT OR NOT.>>OH!>>OH, WELL!>>SO ANYWAY– NOT STAYING FOR THE REST? [ LAUGHTER ]>>OH, THAT’S RIGHT. IT WOULD BE MY TURN, ACTUALLY.>>PROBABLY BRANDON’S.>>I BROKE A RECORD.>>THANK YOU.>>YEAH.>>THANK YOU.>>YOU ALWAYS LEAVE BEFORE YOU HEAR WHAT JOHN AND I HAVE TO SAY, BUT WE’RE NOT SENSITIVE TO THAT. APPROVAL OF THE STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION MINUTES OF OCTOBER 1, 2014. MOTION, PLEASE?>>SO MOVED.>>SUPPORT.>>MOVED BY CASANDRA, SUPPORTED BY DAN. CHANGES?>>IS THAT APPROPRIATE? AS SECRETARY, AM I ALLOWED TO ACTUALLY–>>YEAH.>>WHY WOULDN’T YOU?>>SHOULD I ACTUALLY? IS IT–>>YEAH.>>IT’S NOT THE GOING ON THE MINUTES.>>SPEAKING OF MINUTES, MAYBE I SHOULDN’T BE ACTUALLY MAKING THE MOTION OR SUPPORTING, RIGHT? [ OVERLAPPING CHATTER ]>>ALTHOUGH, PRACTICALLY SPEAKING, WE ALL KNOW THAT’S MARILYN.>>THANK GOD.>>SORRY.>>SO, ALL IN FAVOR, AYE.>>all: AYE.>>OPPOSED, SAME. APPROVAL OF THE MINUTES OF THE REGULAR AND COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE, OCTOBER 14th. OCTOBER 14th.>>SO MOVED.>>MOVED BY CASANDRA.>>SUPPORT.>>SUPPORTED BY JOHN.>>CAN I MAKE SOME SUGGESTIONS TO CORRECT THINGS?>>YES.>>ADD A SENTENCE OR SOMETHING TO THE MINUTES. I DON’T KNOW IF–>>OF THE 14th?>>YES.>>CLARIFY SOMETHING I SAID, THAT’S ALL.>>OKAY.>>AND I’LL FIX IT.>>DOES MERTZ HAVE THAT?>>I’LL FIX IT. I HAVE IT.>>SO THAT WITH THAT AMENDMENT.>>YEAH.>>ALL IN FAVOR, AYE.>>all: AYE.>>OPPOSED, SAME. THANK YOU. AND APPROVAL OF THE MINUTES OF THE SPECIAL MEETING OF OCTOBER 22nd.>>SO MOVED.>>SORRY, DAN– YOU CAN’T MOVE. [ LAUGHTER ]>>MOVED BY DAN, SUPPORTED BY– YES, YOU CAN– KATHLEEN. ANY OTHER COMMENTS? CHANGES? ALL IN FAVOR, AYE.>>all: AYE.>>OPPOSED, SAME. MOTION PASSES. PRESIDENT’S REPORT, JOHN.>>I WILL JUST ADD CONGRATULATIONS CASANDRA. I’M VERY HAPPY THAT YOU’LL BE BACK. AND PAMELA SMITH PUGH, WHO ALSO IS TERRIFIC, AND CONGRATULATIONS TO HER. SHE COULDN’T MAKE IT TODAY. HER MOTHER HAD A– THE NIGHT OF THE ELECTION, HER MOTHER HAD A HEART ISSUE, FOREWARNING OF A HEART ATTACK, AND SO SHE’S AT U OF M MEDICAL CENTER AND WAS OPERATED ON YESTERDAY. I DON’T KNOW THE RESULTS, BUT WE’RE EXPECTING A GOOD PROGNOSIS TO PUT SOME STENTS IN, BUT ANYWAYS, PAMELA IS LOOKING FORWARD TO THIS AND IS TERRIFIC, AND WE’LL WELCOME HER WHEN SHE SHOWS UP NEXT TIME.>>SHE SAID SHE WOULD BE HERE AT THAT MEETING, SO THAT’S GREAT. AND NOW, MY REPORT. I’M GOING TO SAY, JAN, I’M GOING TO SKIP THE VIDEO PART IN THE INTEREST OF TIME. I DO HAVE A FEW THINGS I WANT TO SAY, BUT THANK YOU FOR BEING THERE TO REMIND ME TO DO THAT.>>OH, COME ON. HOW LONG IS THAT VIDEO? [ LAUGHTER ]>>NO, IT’S NOT MINE.>>–PLANNED TO BE HERE, SO–>>OKAY, SO SOMEBODY’S GOING TO TRACK HER DOWN WHILE I MAKE A FEW OTHER COMMENTS. YOU KNOW, I– ONE THING I’M GOING TO TRY TO RESOLVE IN MY BOOK– [ LAUGHTER ] SERIOUSLY RESOLVE, IS– I MEAN, WE LOSE PEOPLE BECAUSE OF NOT ABLE TO BE– KIND OF REFERRED TO THEM A FEW MINUTES AGO– NOT BEING ABLE TO EASILY RESPOND TO WHAT I THINK IS CLOSE TO LIBEL. I’M NOT AN ELECTED OFFICIAL. THE FOLKS THAT WORK HERE SURELY AREN’T. AND THERE’S A POINT WHERE MIS-QUOTES– YOU KNOW, I’M JUST GOING TO GET THIS ON THE TABLE. I WISH I HADN’T, IN QUOTES, USED A TERM THAT IS INAPPROPRIATE, “WHEELCHAIR PROTESTER,” BUT IT WAS IN QUOTES. AND I WAS TRYING TO MAKE A POINT, NOT USING THE LANGUAGE MYSELF, BUT IN HINDSIGHT, I WISH I HADN’T USED IT AT ALL, EVEN WITH THE– IN QUOTES. I GET THAT, BUT THAT’S DIFFERENT THAN THE WAY THINGS ARE PRESENTED SOMETIMES. AND SECONDLY, IF YOU LOOK AT– I MEAN, I DON’T KNOW. DAN WOULD KNOW HIM BETTER THAN I AS A LAWYER, BUT I THINK IN GENERAL, A FALSE STATEMENT THAT’S DAMAGING TO A REPUTATION IS LIBEL. AND I THINK THERE’S A POINT WHERE, IN ORDER TO ATTRACT GOOD CANDIDATES, ONE OF THE ISSUES THAT I’LL JUST TELL YOU, I HEAR ABOUT ALL THE TIME IS “HOW HAVE YOU DEVELOPED SUCH THICK SKIN?” THE DEPUTIES PULLED ME ASIDE A FEW WEEKS AGO AND SAID, “DO NOT READ ANY MORE OF THE COMMENTS UNDER THE ARTICLES OR THE TWITTER.”>>OH NO.>>OR THE TWITTERVERSE. YOU ALL GET IT, BUT SOME OF THESE ARE PRETTY– ESPECIALLY THE TWITTERVERSE STUFF, AND I WOULD LOVE, KNOWING THEY’RE WATCHING, SOME OF THE TWITTERVERSE FOLKS RIGHT NOW, I HOPE YOU’RE GOING TO GET INTO THE ARENA AND APPLY, RATHER THAN JUST SIT BACK AND THROW BOMBS ALL THE TIME. I THINK THAT WOULD SHOW SOME LEVEL OF COURAGE FOR PEOPLE TO DO THAT. BUT THAT’S– THAT’S NOT MY PLANNED REPORT. THAT’S JUST SOMETHING I REALLY AM STRUGGLING WITH, BECAUSE I THINK WE HAVE A LOT OF GOOD CANDIDATES IN THE WINGS, HERE, READY TO PUT THEIR HAT IN THE RING, BUT THERE ARE SOME VERY TROUBLED ABOUT THAT. JUST THINKING THE PINATA HAS GOTTEN WORSE FOR ALL OF US. AND IT TAKES ITS TOLL. IT’S JUST DAY IN AND DAY OUT. AND CERTAINLY, WITH SOCIAL MEDIA, YOU JUST– MARTY HAS OCCASIONALLY CORRECTED THE RECORD ON SOME OF THIS STUFF, WHICH I APPRECIATE, BUT MOST OF THE TIME, WE JUST LET IT GO. THERE’S NOT MUCH YOU CAN DO ABOUT IT. IT’S PAINFUL BECAUSE SO OFTEN, WITH SUCH MISINFORMATION, AND I THINK IT LEAVES A DEPARTMENT REPUTATION THAT’S NOT ACCURATE. TODAY, I DON’T TAKE THAT IN THE SPIRIT OF PUBLIC PARTICIPATION ON OUR SPECIAL ED CHILDREN. I THINK THOSE ARE HEARTFELT ISSUES THAT PEOPLE WHO’VE EXPERIENCED THIS HAVE EVERY RIGHT TO BE CONCERNED ABOUT. HAVING SAID THAT, I ALSO THINK THAT OUR DEPARTMENT DOES AN EXCELLENT JOB DOWN IN THAT DIVISION. WE CAN DO BETTER. I’VE HEARD SOME COMMENTS TODAY THAT WE SHOULD TRY TO TAKE A LOOK AT AND TRY TO THINK– BUT LARGELY, EVEN WHEN I HEARD THE INFERENCE THAT SOMEHOW I’M MR. SPECIAL ED– WE ACTUALLY– 99% OF THIS IS FOLLOWING THE STATE AND FEDERAL LAW. I MEAN, I CAN’T EVEN THINK OF THE LAST TIME THERE WAS A SUPS GROUP ITEM ON ANYTHING RELATED TO SPECIAL ED, BECAUSE SO MUCH OF IT IS THAT INTERPRETATION, AND TODAY, I THINK WE LEARNED SOME THINGS THAT WILL BE HELPFUL. FOR INSTANCE, THIS IDEA ABOUT HOW WE MIGHT BE ABLE TO THINK DIFFERENTLY ABOUT SYSTEMIC ISSUES THAT MAYBE AREN’T EASILY GOTTEN TO, AND DO WE HAVE SOME POSSIBILITIES, AND IF NOT, WHAT CAN WE RECOMMEND BE CHANGED IN THE LAW, AND GET TO EITHER CONGRESS OR THE LEGISLATURE HERE? BUT IT REALLY– JUST TO TAKE THE TENSION DOWN A BIT, IT’S NOT LIKE THIS IS– THIS IS ALMOST ALL FOLLOWING THE LAW. AND MAYBE SOME OF THAT CAN BE, AS I SAID, SUBJECT TO IMPROVEMENT, IN TERMS OF, ESPECIALLY, I THINK THERE WERE SOME EXCELLENT POINTS MADE ABOUT THE CATCH 22, AND THEN CERTAINLY THE PARENT COMMUNICATION ISSUES THAT BOTH MELODY BROUGHT UP AND SOME OF OUR PARTICIPANTS TODAY. I GET THAT. BUT I CAN’T NOT SAY WHAT I SAW TODAY, WHICH WAS OUR FOLKS REALLY TAKE THIS SERIOUSLY. THEY’RE ALMOST ALL FORMER SPECIAL EDUCATORS IN THE FIELD WHO GOT INTO THIS PROFESSION BECAUSE OF THEIR CONCERN AND CARE FOR THESE VERY CHILDREN THAT WE’RE TALKING ABOUT. BUT THEY’RE SYSTEM ISSUES, SO WE CAN AND SHOULD WORK ON THAT, AND I THOUGHT– APPRECIATE THE DISCUSSION FROM THE BOARD THERE. I GOT RID OF ALL MY REGULAR STUFF. I CROSSED IT ALL OUT BECAUSE JUST A FEW THINGS TODAY– I MEAN– I’M NOT SURE WHAT THE NON-COMEDY CHANNEL JOHN STEWART WAS TRYING TO SAY ABOUT THERE’S NOT A TEACHER SHORTAGE, BUT WE’VE GOTTEN SO MALIGNED ON THIS, I THINK I NEED TO CLEAR THE AIR A LITTLE BIT. WE DID ISSUE SOMETHING ABOUT A MONTH OR SO AGO, BECAUSE WE SAW THAT IT SAID 100 TEACHERS SHORT IN DETROIT, SO WE THOUGHT WE NEED TO TRY TO HELP REMEDY THAT. THE WORST CASE OF ALL IS ASKING THEM TO TRY TO REACH HIGHER LEVELS OF ACHIEVEMENT, AND THEN THERE’S NO ONE IN THE CLASSROOM. IT DID GET PANNED, ALMOST, AS NOT CARING ABOUT CERTIFIED TEACHERS. THAT’S NOT THE CASE AT ALL– THAT’S THE PREFERENCE. IN FACT, WHAT YOU’LL SEE VANESSA, ABBY, SOME OTHERS HERE HAVE WORKED ON, WHAT WAS REFERENCED IS KIND OF THE TEACHER CORPS– THAT WAS MEANT TO GET AT– IN GENERAL, I THINK IT’S RIGHT THAT THERE’S NOT AN OVERALL TEACHER SHORTAGE, BUT THERE DEFINITELY IS A TEACHER SHORTAGE IN CERTAIN AREAS. IT’S JUST BEYOND DENYING. AND THEN NOT ONLY IN CERTAIN AREAS, BUT IN CERTAIN CONTENT AREAS ACROSS THE WHOLE STATE. AND THEN WE WONDER WHY– YOU KNOW, LET’S JUST DO SCIENCE, YEAH. THE NEXT SEVEN YEARS. EVERYTHING’S GOING TO BE FINE. NOT IF WE DON’T HAVE TRAINED SCIENCE TEACHERS, BECAUSE THEY’RE ALL GOING STRAIGHT INTO THE PRIVATE SECTOR. SO I MEAN, I JUST WANT THE BOARD, BECAUSE WE CARE ABOUT WHAT YOU THINK AND TRY NOT TO CARE AS MUCH ABOUT WHAT THE OTHER FOLKS THINK, BUT THAT’S JUST NOT THE CASE. WE VERY MUCH RESPECT THE CERTIFIED TEACHER ROLE. THAT’S WHY WE SPENT SO MUCH TIME ON IT. I THINK LEAH, IN HER INTERIM ROLE, IS WORKING HARD AT THAT. FLORA DID A GREAT JOB DURING HER TIME HERE. BUT WE HAVE NICHES RIGHT NOW THAT WE’RE ASKING FOR JUST IMPOSSIBLE SITUATIONS FOR DISTRICTS OR SCHOOLS TO HELP TURN AROUND IF THEY CAN’T GET THE VERY PROFESSIONALLY TRAINED TEACHERS THEY NEED. AND WE’RE EVEN– YOU KNOW, WE GOT A LITTLE BIT OF A SHOT OVER THE BOW FROM ONE INSTITUTION, SO I FINALLY SAID, “COME ON IN. LET’S BRING A TEAM. YOU BRING A TEAM.” AND MAYBE THERE’S SOMETHING WE’RE MISSING ON THIS, BUT THEY KEEP SAYING, “WE’RE PRODUCING ALL THE TEACHERS, AND THEY’RE IN THE WINGS.” AND WHEN I SAY, “WELL, CAN YOU HELP ME MATCH THEM UP WITH DETROIT?” AND I ARRANGE A MEETING WITH JACK MARTIN ON THAT WHOLE THING, AND SUDDENLY IT’S A NO-SHOW. SO I MEAN, WHAT IS THAT ALL ABOUT? I DON’T KNOW, BUT IT’S GENUINELY WITHIN TRYING TO FIGURE OUT, PARTICULARLY IN THE REMOTE RURAL AREAS AND IN THE URBAN AREAS, WHERE WE CANNOT– WHEN I TAUGHT AT WAYNE STATE FOR 15 YEARS, I HAD ALMOST ALL TEACHERS FROM DETROIT, AND YOU REALIZED EVEN BACK THE FIRST YEAR, WHICH WAS 17 OR 18 YEARS AGO– I HAVEN’T DONE IT THE LAST FEW YEARS– THEY WERE DESPERATE TO FIND PARTICULARLY SCIENCE AND MATH TEACHERS. SO I HOPE THAT CLARIFIES THAT A LITTLE BIT, AND I PROBABLY COULD’VE WORDED SOME THINGS DIFFERENTLY, AS USUAL. OKAY, I THINK I’M DONE. OH, SO, YOU KNOW, WE– JEREMY WAS REFERENCED EARLIER– [ LAUGHTER ] NO, I DID, I KNEW– I CITED EARLIER, BUT I THINK LUPE WAS THE ONE TO PROPERLY SAY THAT JEREMY HAD A BIG HAND IN OUR EARLY CHILDHOOD WORK. SHULAWN DOXIE, WHO’S BEEN WITH THE DEPARTMENT IN A NUMBER OF ROLES, MOST RECENTLY AS MANAGER OF GRANTS COORDINATION AND SCHOOL SYSTEM, WILL– THE EASIEST WAY TO SAY IT IS GOING TO BE THE NEW JEREMY REUTER, IF THAT’S AN INAPPROPRIATE WAY. WOULD YOU JUST STAND UP AND BE RECOGNIZED? WE’RE HAPPY TO HAVE YOU ON BOARD. [ APPLAUSE ] I DON’T THINK SUSAN’S ON THE PHONE ANYMORE, BUT SHE’S WATCHING PROBABLY– RIGHT. [ LAUGHTER ] AND THIS IS REALLY THE SAA FOR SUSAN THE WAY THAT ABBY IS FOR TWO DEPUTIES, AND THE WAY THAT ROSS IS WITH KYLE. SO WE’RE HAPPY TO HAVE YOU ON BOARD. GLAD YOU COULD TROT DOWN THE HALL HERE SO THE BOARD COULD SEE YOU. NOW, I DO WANT TO SAY THIS. I WANT A PUBLIC ANNOUNCEMENT, BECAUSE MY DAUGHTER HAPPENED TO BE AT A PROFESSIONAL DEVELOPMENT OPPORTUNITY WITH TEACHERS AND JUST RAVED ABOUT THIS TEACHER OF THE YEAR. AND SHE TEXTED ME, AND I SAID, “WELL, ARE YOU STILL THERE?” AND SHE SAID YES, SO I SAID, “WELL, GO UP AND INTRODUCE YOURSELF.” WELL, I FOUND OUT LATER WHERE SHE INTRODUCED HERSELF, WHICH WAS WHERE?>>IN THE BATHROOM. [ LAUGHTER ] WHICH IS WHY WE DON’T HAVE A PICTURE, UNFORTUNATELY. [ LAUGHTER ] A STRANGE PLACE TO ASK FOR A PICTURE.>>BUT I ALSO WANTED TO THANK YOU. I HAD A CHANCE TO SPEAK AT THE ADVANCED ED CONFERENCE, AND THEY GAVE YOU THE DUTY OF INTRODUCTIONS, AND SOMETIMES THE EMBARRASSMENT OF INTRODUCTIONS IS FIRST OF ALL, THEY’RE BORING AND JUST STUFF PEOPLE DON’T CARE ABOUT, BUT I REALLY APPRECIATED THE KIND OF PERSONAL, HEARTFELT TOUCH. IT WAS VERY APPRECIATED, AND I WAS GLAD THEY ASKED YOU. SO, WITHOUT FURTHER ADO, WE HAVE A REPORT FROM OUR TEACHER OF THE YEAR.>>SO EACH MONTH SEEMS TO GET BUSIER AND MORE EXCITING. AND DEFINITELY, A LOT HAPPENED SINCE THE LAST BOARD MEETING, AND I’M EXCITED TO SHARE. ONE OF THE THINGS MY DISTRICT HAS BEEN DOING IS TWITTER CHATS, AND I’VE BEEN PARTICIPATING, SINCE I’VE BECOME VERY ACTIVE ON TWITTER IN THE LAST YEAR. BUT I WAS ASKED TO FACILITATE A TWITTER CHAT FOR A DISTRICT, AND THAT WAS SOMETHING NEW FOR ME, BUT I DID IT WITH THE HELP OF OUR TECHNOLOGY COORDINATOR FOR OUR DISTRICT. AND IT WAS A GREAT EXPERIENCE. THIS IS JUST ONE OF THE FUNNY THINGS THAT SOMEBODY HAD POSTED, BUT OUR HASHTAG IS #WLECED, WHICH STANDS FOR WALLED LAKE EVERY CHILD EVERY DAY, AND THESE TWITTER CHATS HAVE BEEN HAPPENING EVERY OTHER TUESDAY, AND THAT’S HELPED ME BECOME COMFORTABLE IN JOINING ON WITH OTHER CHATS. SO I’VE ALSO PARTICIPATED IN A MICH-ED CHAT LATELY. I ALSO WORKED WITH THE TEACHER LEADERSHIP ACADEMY IN THE KENT SCHOOL DISTRICT, WHICH IS IN GRAND RAPIDS. THAT WAS A GREAT EXPERIENCE BECAUSE IT MIRRORS WHAT I DID IN GALILEO AND THE THINGS WE LEARNED ABOUT THERE. AND SPEAKING OF TWITTER, IT’S GREAT WHEN YOU CAN MEET SOMEONE VIRTUALLY AND GET TO KNOW THEM AND THEN ACTUALLY MEET THEM IN PERSON. SO THIS IS SOMEBODY THAT I’VE COMMUNICATED A LOT ON TWITTER, AND THEN IT WAS NICE TO MEET IN PERSON. HIS NAME IS JEFF BUSH, AND HE DOES A LOT OF PROFESSIONAL DEVELOPMENT FOR TEACHERS IN GRAND RAPIDS. NOW, THE BEAUTY OF THAT DAY WAS I HAPPENED TO MENTION MY CULTURE AND ALSO THE ORGANIZATION THAT I’VE HELPED PUT TOGETHER, WHICH IS TEACH– TEACHERS EDUCATING AND CREATING HOPE, AND I ACTUALLY DIDN’T PLAN ON MENTIONING IT THAT DAY, BUT IT JUST CAME UP. AND WHEN WE DID A Q&A, MOST OF THE QUESTIONS WERE AROUND THAT, AND PEOPLE WANTED TO KNOW MORE. ONE OF THE TEACHERS THERE CAME UP TO ME AFTERWARD AND SAID SHE WAS ON THE CHAIR WITH THE MICHIGAN READING ASSOCIATION, AND THAT THEY DO AN INTERNATIONAL PROJECT EVERY YEAR, AND SHE WAS PUT IN CHARGE OF THAT AND WASN’T QUITE SURE WHAT THEY WANTED TO DO. SHE ASKED IF WE’D LIKE TO PARTNER WITH THEM, SO I’M VERY EXCITED TO SHARE THAT WE ARE PARTNERED NOW WITH THE MICHIGAN READING ASSOCIATION, AND THEY’RE ASKING ALL OF THEIR SECTORS AND ARE WORKING TO COLLECT LITERACY AND READING MATERIALS FOR THE DISPLACED CHILDREN IN IRAQ, WHO’VE NOW GONE SEVERAL MONTHS WITHOUT ANY SCHOOLING AND WILL PROBABLY HAVE AT LEAST A YEAR WITHOUT SCHOOL. SO I’M EXCITED FOR THAT, AND THEY’VE ALREADY PUT THAT INTO MOTION, SENT OUT A NEWSLETTER, AND HAVE THEIR ORGANIZATIONS WORKING ON THAT. SO– AND THAT WAS– LIKE I SAID, IT JUST KIND OF HAPPENED AFTER I MENTIONED SOMETHING, SO YOU JUST NEVER KNOW THE TYPES OF CONNECTIONS THAT CAN COME OUT OF THESE EVENTS. SOON AFTER, I WENT TO TAMPA, FLORIDA WITH A GREAT TEAM FROM THE MDE, INCLUDING LINDA FORWARD, ERIKA BOLIG, GREGG DIONNE, AND ANDREW MIDDLESTEAD, AND IT WAS FOR A CCSSO TOPICAL MEETING, AND THERE WAS A LOT OF DISCUSSION AND INTEREST IN THE TEACHER PERSPECTIVE, WHICH WAS REALLY NICE. AND SOME DIALOGUE ABOUT TEACHERS PARTICIPATING WITH THEIR STATE DEPARTMENTS. SO THESE WERE JUST SOME OF OUR KEY IDEAS THINKING ABOUT TEACHERS AS LEADERS AND AMPLIFYING THAT TEACHER VOICE. WHILE I WAS THERE, I GOT TO MEET TWO OTHER TEACHERS OF THE YEAR FROM THEIR STATES, AND THAT WAS GREAT AND EXCITING AND KIND OF GOT US EXCITED FOR WHAT’S TO COME IN 2015. THIS IS SARAH LOOMIS, AND SHE’S FROM DODEA, WHICH IS THE DEPARTMENT OF DEFENSE– I CAN’T REMEMBER THE REST OF THE ACRONYM, BUT WE’VE BEEN IN CONTACT QUITE A BIT SINCE THEN, AND ACTUALLY, WE’VE PUT TOGETHER A FACEBOOK PAGE FOR THE 2015 STATE TEACHERS OF THE YEAR SO THAT WE CAN CONNECT BEFORE WE GET TO MEET, WHICH IS GREAT. WE HAVE ABOUT 20 PEOPLE ON THAT PAGE SO FAR. AS PEOPLE ARE BEING NAMED, THEY’RE JOINING. AND THIS IS AMANDA MILINER, AND SHE’S FROM GEORGIA. I ALSO GOT TO MEET THE NATIONAL TEACHER OF THE YEAR OF 2014, SEAN McCOMB. AND HE WAS VERY INSPIRING, THOUGHTFUL, AND WILLING TO ANSWER QUESTIONS. ALSO, HE DID A GREAT SPEECH TO THE CROWD JUST ABOUT THE IMPORTANCE OF SEEING TEACHERS AS LEADERS, WHICH I APPRECIATED. I WORKED WITH SOMEONE FROM THE CCSSO NAMED KAREN BUTTERFIELD, WHO’S PUTTING TOGETHER A BLOG ABOUT TEACHER PARTICIPATION AT THE STATE LEVEL. SHE ASKED ME TO PUT TOGETHER A VIDEO AND DO A LITTLE INTERVIEW THAT SHE POSTED TO THEIR BLOG, WHICH IS NOW CURRENTLY ON THEIR WEBSITE. I FINALLY COMPLETED MY NATIONAL TEACHER OF THE YEAR APPLICATION, WHICH WAS PRETTY INTENSE. BUT I WAS VERY HAPPY TO SEND THAT OFF, AND — WELL, NOW I’LL PUT IT OUT OF MY MIND. BUT IT’S A GREAT PROCESS. VERY SIMILAR TO MICHIGAN’S, MAYBE JUST DIGGING A LITTLE BIT DEEPER INTO OUR VALUES AND BELIEFS AS EDUCATORS. I VISITED GROSSE POINTE NORTH HIGH SCHOOL, AND I GOT TO CHECK OUT, ACTUALLY THROUGH GARY ABUD, THIS DIGITAL SEMINAR CLASS THAT THEY HAVE, WHERE THEIR STUDENTS ARE ACTUALLY LEARNING ABOUT 3D PRINTING AND DOING THE DESIGN AND ALL THE MATH AND ALL THE DIFFERENT ELEMENTS THAT GO INTO THAT. SO I THOUGHT THAT THAT WAS PRETTY FASCINATING THAT THEY HAVE THAT IN HIGH SCHOOL. AND THEN AS MIKE MENTIONED, I WAS THE KEYNOTE SPEAKER FOR GROSSE POINTE SCHOOLS’ PROFESSIONAL DEVELOPMENT DAY, ANOTHER FIRST FOR ME, THE FIRST TIME I’VE EVER DONE SOMETHING LIKE THAT. BUT THE TEACHERS WERE SO WELCOMING, AND WE HAD A GREAT TIME. THEY WERE VERY RECEPTIVE TO HEARING FROM ANOTHER TEACHER. AND THAT WAS, OF COURSE, WHERE I MET MIKE’S DAUGHTER, WHO IS LOVELY. UNFORTUNATELY, I DID NOT GET TO TAKE A PICTURE, LIKE WE SAID.>>SHE’S HOPING TO HOLD THIS JOB. SHE’S BEEN LAID OFF FROM THREE PREVIOUS DISTRICTS BY SENIORITY, SO SHE’S HOPING THIS ONE HOLDS.>>WELL, I GOT A GREAT FEEL FROM GROSSE POINTE IN GENERAL, AND THAT WHOLE DAY REVOLVED AROUND TEACHERS AS LEADERS, AND ALL OF THE PROFESSIONAL DEVELOPMENT WAS TEACHER-LED. SO TEACHERS WERE ABLE TO POSE DIFFERENT WORKSHOPS THEY MIGHT OFFER, AND THEN OTHER TEACHERS COULD ATTEND THOSE. AND I GOT TO DO A COUPLE OF THOSE AS WELL, AND SO I THINK THAT’S REALLY THE FUTURE OF PROFESSIONAL DEVELOPMENT AS FAR AS WHAT TEACHERS WANT.>>IT’S GOOD.>>MMM-HMM. I DID GET TO SPEAK ABOUT BULLYING DURING THAT KEYNOTE SPEECH, AND THE COMMONALITIES I’VE SEEN BETWEEN ADULT BULLIES AND KID BULLIES, AND THE IMPORTANCE OF IDENTIFYING THAT IN WORKPLACES. BECAUSE, UNFORTUNATELY, IN SCHOOLS, THERE IS A LOT OF WORKPLACE BULLYING, AND THAT’S SOMETHING THAT EVEN I’VE EXPERIENCED, BUT THE KEY THINGS THAT 3rd GRADE BULLIES AND ADULT BULLIES HAVE IN COMMON IS THAT THEY DON’T SEE THEMSELVES AS BULLIES, AND THAT’S SOMETHING I TALKED ABOUT QUITE A BIT. AND I’D LIKE TO THANK MIKE FOR GRACIOUSLY ALLOWING ME TO USE A QUOTE FROM HIM ON THE TOPIC FOR MY BOOK, WHICH I THOUGHT I WOULD HAVE A PROOF FOR TODAY, BUT EVERYTHING TAKES A LITTLE LONGER THAN USUAL– BUT VERY SOON, WHICH WAS EXCITING AS WELL. AND FOR OUR AFTER-SESSION FOR THIS, WHERE WE DID SOME Q&A, THERE WAS SO MUCH DISCUSSION ABOUT THE BULLYING THAT’S HAPPENING AMONGST THEIR COLLEAGUES, AND HOW IT’S VERY SUBTLE BUT IT IS THERE, AND HOW PEOPLE CAN BECOME MORE AWARE OF THAT. AND THEIR WHOLE THEME THAT DAY WAS MAKING CONNECTIONS, AND WE JUST TALKED A LOT THAT DAY ABOUT HOW THAT’S LIKE THE NUMBER ONE KILLER OF ANY CONNECTION, TO HAVE THAT NEGATIVE TONE BETWEEN THE ADULTS.>>I THINK YOU REALLY HAVE A UNIQUE VIEW OF THAT, IS WHY I SHARED AN EMAIL WITH YOU, AND THEN YOU DECIDED TO KIND OF TURN IT INTO A QUOTE, BUT I — THE BOARD WOULD BE EXCITED EVEN NOW– CAN YOU GIVE A QUICK SYNOPSIS THAT? I THINK IT’S–>>SURE, SURE. SO THE EXPERIENCE THAT I HAD WITH 3rd GRADERS, WHICH THEN I STARTED TO SEE THE PARALLEL WITH ADULT BULLYING OR ANY BULLYING IN GENERAL IS THAT THERE’S THIS MISCONCEPTION OF THIS BULLY STEREOTYPE THAT KIDS SEE ON TV. IT’S THAT BIG, DUMB, MEAN MALE BULLY, OR ON THE FEMALE END, THE AIR-HEADED, SELF-ABSORBED FEMALE. AND THOSE DON’T REALLY EXIST IN REAL LIFE, AND SO THE PROBLEM IS WHEN YOU TRY TO EXPLAIN TO A CHILD THAT THEIR BEHAVIOR IS BULLYING, THEY GET DEFENSIVE AND SAY, “WELL, I’M NOT A BULLY,” OF COURSE, BECAUSE THEY DON’T SEE THEMSELVES THAT WAY, BECAUSE THEY’RE NOT THAT WAY. SO JUST SOME WAYS TO BREAK THAT BARRIER IS TO EXPLAIN TO KIDS THAT A BULLY AS A PERSON DOESN’T EXIST, BUT THAT REALLY OUR ACTIONS ARE BULLYING, AND THAT WE ALL ACT THAT WAY SOMETIMES, EVEN ADULTS, AND EVEN SOMEONE LIKE MYSELF WHO’S VERY AWARE OF IT. I CATCH MYSELF DOING THINGS SOMETIMES THAT COULD BE SEEN AS BULLYING. SO THAT LITTLE SHIFT RIGHT THERE REALLY HELPS KIDS KIND OF TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR THEIR ACTIONS AND BE WILLING TO APOLOGIZE FOR THOSE THINGS AND MAKE THOSE CHANGES. SO THAT’S REALLY THE FOCUS OF MY BOOK: A CHARACTER THAT DEFIES THE BULLY STEREOTYPE, BUT COMES TO THE REALIZATION THAT HER ACTIONS ARE BULLYING, AND THAT’S THE MESSAGE I HOPE TO SPREAD WITH THIS PLATFORM. I WAS ALSO– I GOT TO BE ON THE PANEL TO SELECT THE SUPERINTENDENT OF THE YEAR, AND ACTUALLY GOT TO DO THAT WITH LUPE, WHICH WAS A GREAT EXPERIENCE JUST TO SEE HOW THAT PROCESS WORKS AND SEE THE GREAT CANDIDATES THAT WERE OUT THERE. AND I DON’T THINK THE ANNOUNCEMENT HAS BEEN MADE YET, SO I’LL KEEP THAT TO MYSELF.>>IT’S YVONNE, OUR FORMER DEPARTMENT–>>OH, THEY DID SHARE IT? OKAY. THEY TOLD US THEY WOULD EMAIL US WHEN THEY MADE IT PUBLIC, SO–>>WELL, IT WAS IN THE PAPER.>>OH, GOOD. YAY!>>ANYBODY REMEMBER YVONNE IN LANSING HERE?>>– EXTRA MONEY, YOU KNOW, FACILITATING THINGS.>>OH.>>BESIDES WORKING FOR ALL MEDIA.>>TAKES ONE STORY AND SELLS IT FIVE WAYS. SERIOUSLY, RIGHT, GUYS?>>YEAH, THE BBC, XYZ…>>YOU’VE GOT TO GET HIS FORMULA DOWN. CBS HAS A LITTLE DIFFERENT VERSION, AND THEN HE WRITES THE “FREE PRESS,” AND THEN…>>I GOT TO PRESENT AT THE ADVANCED ED FALL CONFERENCE, WHICH WAS IN NOVI, AND THAT’S ALSO WHERE I GOT TO INTRODUCE SUPERINTENDENT FLANAGAN. LUPE GAVE ME SOME GREAT ADVICE ON MY APPROACH WITH THAT INTRODUCTION, WHICH I THOUGHT WAS VERY HELPFUL AND I WAS VERY HAPPY. SO I’M GLAD YOU ENJOYED IT AS WELL. I DID GET TO PRESENT TWO DIFFERENT WORKSHOPS THERE, WHICH I’VE MENTIONED. I HAVE A FOCUS ON MATH FLUENCY SKILLS, SO THAT WITH THOSE– MASTERING THOSE BASIC MATH FACTS THAT WILL HELP BUILD THAT FOUNDATION FOR ALL OTHER MATH. AND THEN ALSO LITERACY, SPECIFICALLY COMPREHENSION WITH A FOCUS ON METACOGNITION AND THE STRATEGIES THAT CAN COME ALONG WITH THAT. LAST WEEK, I VISITED EDISON ELEMENTARY IN FRASIER. THIS IS ACTUALLY ONE OF MY BEST FRIENDS’ SISTER, WHO WORKS THERE, BUT I WAS INTERESTED IN SEEING THEIR SCHOOL BECAUSE THERE’S AN ARTICLE DONE ON THEM ON THEIR 21st CENTURY LEARNING, AND THEY HAVE A 1-1 iPAD TO STUDENT RATIO, WHICH IS GREAT TO SEE IN ACTION. I WAS VERY INTRIGUED BY THE WAYS KIDS WERE UTILIZING THOSE iPADS AND THE WAY THEY’RE DOING TEACHER PROFESSIONAL DEVELOPMENT. SO THEY ACTUALLY HAVE THIS TEACHER WHO DOES LUNCH WITH HER AND DIFFERENT STAFF MEMBERS SO THAT THEY CAN KIND OF KEEP UP TO DATE ON THE LATEST APPS AND DIFFERENT WAYS TO USE THOSE IN THE CLASSROOM. I ALSO VISITED ADRIAN COLLEGE, AND I SPENT THE DAY THERE IN A VARIETY OF DIFFERENT FORUMS, LIKE VISITING THE CLASSES THEY HAD AND ALSO KIND OF A PUBLIC FORUM, AND I WAS ABLE TO SPEAK WITH FUTURE TEACHER LEADERS, WHICH WAS VERY EXCITING. AND I’VE TAKEN A BIG INTEREST IN TEACHER PREPARATION FOR THE FUTURE. AND THEN LASTLY, I WAS SELECTED FOR THE MICHIGAN EDUCATOR VOICE FELLOWSHIP, WHICH IS PUT TOGETHER BY AMERICA ACHIEVES, AND IT’S THEIR– THEY’VE DONE IT IN OTHER STATES AND ARE NOW BRINGING IT TO MICHIGAN. BUT IT’S ALL ABOUT AMPLIFYING THE TEACHER VOICE AND LEARNING HOW TO USE SOCIAL MEDIA TO DO THAT, LEARNING HOW TO UNDERSTAND POLICY– SO REALLY, ALL THE THINGS THAT I’M DOING THIS YEAR WILL HELP ME TO UNDERSTAND THOSE AND MAKE THE MOST OF THOSE OPPORTUNITIES. AND THEN I DON’T HAVE A SLIDE HERE FOR THIS, BUT JUST YESTERDAY I WAS AT THE KELLOGG CENTER FOR THE MICHIGAN VIRTUAL UNIVERSITY ONLINE LEARNING SYMPOSIUM, SO I’M LEARNING A LOT MORE ABOUT BLENDED LEARNING AND THEN ONLINE LEARNING, AND ALL THE DIFFERENT COMPONENTS THAT CAN COME WITH THAT. SO AN EXCITING MONTH, AND VERY BUSY, AND I LOOK FORWARD TO MORE OPPORTUNITIES LIKE THIS IN THE FUTURE.>>GREAT.>>SO WE’RE GOING TO SEE A PROOF OF THE BOOK NEXT MONTH?>>YEAH. I REALLY THOUGHT I’D HAVE IT TODAY, BUT I’M A FEW DAYS OFF. SO THERE’S SOME CHANGES, BUT I’M EXCITED TO BRING IT IN AND SHARE IT. I ACTUALLY WROTE IT 8 YEARS AGO AND THEN WASN’T ABLE TO DO TOO MUCH WITH IT. BUT THEN I THOUGHT THAT THIS WOULD BE THE RIGHT TIME WITH THIS PLATFORM.>>GREAT, GREAT.>>I’M VERY EXCITED.>>GREAT REPORT. THANK YOU, MELODY. VANESSA AND JOSEPH, I KNOW, ARE GOING TO JOIN US NOW, AND I APPRECIATE THE BOARD ALLOWING AN AMENDMENT HERE ONCE WE GOT THE STUFF FINALLY TO TALK ABOUT THE– LET ME THINK NOW. WHAT IS IT CALLED? THE EXTENSION– NO, THE EXTENSION OF THE WAIVER, AS OPPOSED TO– THERE’S THREE TERMS. WE GOT AN APPROVED WAIVER, AND THEN WE GOT AN EXTENSION, AND NOW WE’RE GOING TO GET A RENEWAL, WE HOPE. SO THIS IS A FEATURE OF IT THAT WE WANT TO GET YOUR REACTION TO AND ANY THOUGHTS YOU HAD RELATED TO IT. IT’S GOING TO GIVE YOU A BASIC OVERVIEW OF WHAT WE CALL STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILES AND THE ADVANTAGES OF THEIR USE. THEY’RE POWERFUL WAYS TO MEASURE STUDENT GROWTH AND HELP PROVIDE IMPORTANT INFORMATION THAT COULD BE USED BY PARENTS, TEACHERS, AND SCHOOLS TO UNDERSTAND STUDENT PROGRESS. SO HERE’S OUR TWO EXPERTS, KIND OF IN REVERSE– WELL, NOT REVERSE ROLES, BUT JOSEPH’S GOING TO GO ON TO– I WOULDN’T SAY BIGGER AND BETTER, JUST BIGGER AND DIFFERENT THINGS, AND VANESSA WILL FILL THAT ROLE, SO PLEASE.>>THANK YOU, MIKE. OKAY. WHO’S READY TO TALK STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILES? [ LAUGHTER ]>>WHOOHOO!>>WHOO!>>NOTHING LIKE A GOOD METHODOLOGICAL PRESENTATION AT THE END OF THE DAY, RIGHT? IT’S THE BEST TIME TO DO IT. [ GAVEL BANGS ] WE’RE ALL FIRED UP.>>WHEN I HAD MATH CLASS–>>SO WE PROMISE THIS PRESENTATION HAS PICTURES IN IT, AND HAS BEEN DEVELOPED SPECIFICALLY TO NOT BORE EVERYBODY TO TEARS, SO YOU’LL HAVE TO HELP US SEE IF THAT’S HAPPENING OR NOT. OKAY, SO WHAT ARE STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILES, AND WHY DO WE NEED THEM? STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILES ARE A METHOD OF MEASURING STUDENT GROWTH ON OUR YEAR TO YEAR ASSESSMENTS, SO THINGS LIKE OUR NEW M-STEP SYSTEM OR THE OLD MEAP SYSTEM. ANY ASSESSMENT YOU TAKE YEAR AFTER YEAR. AND– OH, SORRY, I THOUGHT YOU WERE ALREADY ASKING A QUESTION, DAN.>>I WAS, BUT I STOPPED. [ LAUGHTER ]>>HE PUT HIS HAND AWAY.>>LUPE KICKED ME UNDER THE TABLE.>>I’VE ALREADY BORED YOU? [ LAUGHTER ] [ OVERLAPPED CHATTER ]>>OKAY, SO WHY DO WE NEED THEM? WE NEED A MEASURE OF STUDENT GROWTH FOR MORE STUDENTS AND MORE SUBJECTS. BECAUSE THIS TYPE OF MEASURE DOESN’T REQUIRE THAT YOU HAVE TESTING EVERY YEAR, YOU CAN GET IT FOR MORE STUDENTS AND MORE SUBJECTS. AND THE BIGGER POINT IS THAT WHEN WE UNDERSTAND MORE ABOUT STUDENT GROWTH, WE CAN DO MORE AROUND SCHOOL IMPROVEMENT EFFORTS. WE CAN THINK ABOUT CLOSING ACHIEVEMENT GAPS. WE CAN HAVE FAIR ACCOUNTABILITY. OUR EDUCATOR EVALUATIONS DEFINITELY PREDICATE ON HAVING GOOD MEASURES OF STUDENT GROWTH BECAUSE PROFICIENCY IS VERY MUCH KEYED TO WHAT A STUDENT COMES IN WITH, BUT GROWTH IS KEYED TO WHAT HAPPENS TO THEM IN THE SCHOOL WITH THOSE EDUCATORS. SO GETTING TO BETTER MEASUREMENTS OF GROWTH AS WE MOVE FORWARD IS CRITICAL IN MANY DIFFERENT WAYS. SO IN THIS PRESENTATION, WE’RE GOING TO HOLD YOUR ATTENTION AND THRILL YOU WITH OUR EXPLANATION OF STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILES, HOW THEY’RE CALCULATED, WHAT THEY REPRESENT. WE’D REALLY LOVE AND INVITE FEEDBACK ON THIS METHOD, PARTICULARLY ON HOW WE COMMUNICATE ABOUT THIS WITH THE PEOPLE WHO NEED TO HEAR ABOUT IT: THOSE IN THE FIELD, PARENTS, LEGISLATORS, AND OTHER INTERESTED STAKEHOLDERS.>>ALL RIGHT. SO JUST A LITTLE BIT MORE DIVING BACK INTO WHY WE NEED TO CHANGE THE WAY WE’RE DOING GROWTH MEASUREMENT. CURRENTLY, ON THE MEAP, WE HAVE WHAT IS CALLED PERFORMANCE LEVEL CHANGE, WHERE WE TRACK STUDENTS THROUGH THE VARIOUS CATEGORIES, AND WE ACTUALLY DIVIDE THEM INTO MULTIPLE PIECES AND TRACK THEM THROUGH THOSE PIECES FROM ONE YEAR TO THE NEXT. THAT WORKS REALLY WELL WHEN YOU DO HAVE ADJACENT GRADE LEVEL MEASUREMENT AND WHEN YOU HAVE THE SAME TEST FROM YEAR TO YEAR. WHEN YOU DON’T HAVE THAT, YOU HAVE TO DO SOMETHING DIFFERENT. THE PROBLEM ALSO IS THAT WE HAVE MEASUREMENTS THAT WE COULD RELY ON FOR GRADES 4-8 IN ENGLISH LANGUAGE, READING, AND MATHEMATICS. THAT’S IT. FOR US, THAT’S A LITTLE PROBLEMATIC. WE’D LIKE TO HAVE MORE THAN THAT, PARTICULARLY FOR HIGH SCHOOLS. WE’D LIKE TO BE ABLE TO IDENTIFY IF STUDENTS ARE GAINING AND HOW WELL THEY’RE LEARNING IN HIGH SCHOOL OVER MAYBE THE PERIOD FROM GRADES 8-11 OR 7-11. THAT’S NOT SOMETHING WE CURRENTLY HAVE AVAILABLE, BECAUSE IT’S A VERY DIFFERENT TEST. BUT SINCE WE DEVELOPED THE PERFORMANCE LEVEL CHANGE METRIC A FEW YEARS AGO, THERE’VE BEEN SIGNIFICANT ADVANCEMENTS IN THE FIELD OF MEASURING STUDENT PROGRESS AND GROWTH, AND STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILES IS ONE OF THEM THAT IS THE MOST NIMBLE, THE MOST CONFIGURABLE TO HANDLE THE KINDS OF THINGS WE’RE TALKING ABOUT HERE. ONE THING I DO WANT TO STATE BEFORE WE GET THERE–>>IS THAT ACTUALLY A WORD? [ LAUGHTER ]>>CONFIGURABLE?>>CONFIGURABLE? YES.>>IS IT?>>YES. [ LAUGHTER ]>>YOU’RE ABLE TO CONFIGURE IT.>>ACTUALLY, IT’S A JOSEPH WORD.>>IT IS A JOSEPH WORD.>>YEAH.>>YOU’RE GOING TO MISS THIS.>>HE’S A LAWYER QUESTIONING WORDS.>>AND I SHOULD ADD, HE’S A PSYCHOMETRICIAN. AND PSYCHOMETRICIANS KNOW THESE THINGS. SO HE MEANS IT.>>OKAY, WELL, MOVING ON. [ LAUGHTER ] I THINK– I DO WANT TO STATE CLEARLY THAT WHEN PEOPLE THINK ABOUT STUDENT GROWTH, THEY OFTEN THINK ABOUT MEASURING SOMETHING LIKE THE HEIGHT OF A STUDENT OVER TIME, WHERE YOU TAKE A YARDSTICK AND MEASURE THE INCHES TALL THAT A STUDENT IS, AND THEN MEASURE THE SAME THING NEXT YEAR, AND YOU SUBTRACT ONE FROM THE OTHER, AND THAT GIVES YOU A GROWTH MEASUREMENT. WHAT I CAN CATEGORICALLY SAY IS THAT A GROWTH MEASUREMENT ON AN ASSESSMENT IS NOT THAT EASY. SOME REASONS FOR THAT IS THAT WE CHANGE MEASURES EVERY YEAR. WE ASK STUDENTS TO LEARN DIFFERENT THINGS FROM GRADE TO GRADE. SO YOU HAVE TO HAVE SOMETHING A LITTLE MORE COMPLEX THAN A STRAIGHT RULER. ESSENTIALLY, IT DOESN’T REALLY MATTER WHAT YOU USE AS A STUDENT GROWTH MEASUREMENT IN EDUCATIONAL ASSESSMENT– YOU’RE GETTING CLOSE TO A TRUE GROWTH MEASUREMENT, BUT THERE IS NO TRUE GROWTH MEASUREMENT IN EDUCATIONAL ASSESSMENT. THESE ARE GOOD MEASURES OF STUDENT LEARNING OVER TIME, SO WE TRY TO– THE SHORTCUT IS GROWTH, BUT LET’S JUST BE CLEAR THAT THIS IS A GOOD MEASUREMENT MEASURING PROGRESS OVER TIME, BUT IT’S NOT LIKE A RULER. AND THERE ARE LOTS OF DIFFERENT WAYS YOU CAN DO IT, BUT THIS IS A VERY HELPFUL ONE. AND THERE ARE A FEW REASONS WHY, AND I’LL GO OVER THOSE AS WE GO OVER THIS PRESENTATION. SO STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILES REPRESENT ONE POWERFUL WAY– OF MANY POTENTIAL, BUT WE THINK THIS IS THE BEST ONE WE HAVE AT OUR DISPOSAL. CONCEPTUALLY, STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILES DESCRIBE THE VARIATION OF A STUDENT’S LEARNING COMPARED TO THE LEARNING OF OTHER STUDENTS WHO HAD EQUIVALENT PAST TEST SCORES OR TEST SCORE HISTORIES. SO WE ESSENTIALLY SAY WHERE DID THE STUDENTS START OUT? AND THEN WE LOOK AT WHERE THEY ENDED UP COMPARED TO ALL THE STUDENTS WHO STARTED OUT IN THE SAME PLACE. IN OTHER WORDS, HOW MUCH DID A STUDENT IMPROVE RELATIVE TO THEIR PEERS, GIVEN WHERE THEY STARTED OUT IN A PREVIOUS YEAR? IN ORDER TO CALCULATE STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILES, STUDENTS ARE GROUPED TOGETHER WITH OTHER STUDENTS THROUGHOUT THE STATE WHO HAD EQUIVALENT SCORES ON THE PREVIOUS TEST. THE STUDENTS ARE THEN ORDERED IN THEIR GROUP BASED ON THE CURRENT YEAR TEST SCORES. EACH STUDENT THEN RECEIVES THEIR PERCENTILE RANK BASED ON THE ORDER OF THE GROUP. SO LET ME SHOW YOU HOW THIS WORKS. SOME OF THE BASIC QUESTIONS ARE HOW TO INTERPRET THIS, WHAT IS A STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILE, AND WHY ARE STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILES HELPFUL FOR PARENTS AND EDUCATORS? SO WE WANT TO LOOK AT TWO STUDENTS WHO APPEAR TO BE VERY SIMILAR, BUT IN REALITY, ARE ACTUALLY QUITE DIFFERENT. SO I LOOK AT JANE, WHO TOOK THE MOST RECENT GRADE 4 MATHEMATICS TEST AND RECEIVED A SCALE SCORE OF 434. THE NUMBER DOESN’T MEAN A LOT OTHER THAN THAT IT’S THE SAME AS THE NEXT STUDENT. IT ALSO, WE CAN SAY, JUST HAPPENED TO BE THE STATE AVERAGE AND PLACED STUDENTS IN A PROFICIENT PERFORMANCE LEVEL. THAT TELLS US A LOT ABOUT WHERE SHE IS NOW, BUT DOESN’T TELL US ABOUT HOW MUCH OF THAT IS NEW LEARNING. HOW CAN WE REPRESENT JANE’S GROWTH OVER TIME JUST BASED ON THAT? SO JOHN, AGAIN, ALSO TOOK THE MOST RECENT GRADE 4 MATH TEST AND RECEIVED A SCALE SCORE OF 434. AGAIN, THAT HAPPENED TO BE THE STATE AVERAGE AND WAS IN THE PROFICIENCY LEVEL. AGAIN, HOW MUCH OF THAT IS NEW LEARNING? WE KNOW THEY’RE IN THE SAME PLACE STANDARDS-WISE. ON THEIR LEVEL OF ACHIEVEMENT, THEY’RE AT THE SAME PLACE, BUT HOW MUCH GROWTH DID THEY SHOW OVER TIME? HOW MUCH LEARNING CAN WE INFER FROM THIS OVER TIME? SO LET’S TAKE A LOOK AT JANE. ONE WAY TO BETTER UNDERSTAND JANE’S GROWTH IS TO LOOK AT ALL THE STUDENTS WHO SCORED THE SAME AS JANE ON LAST YEAR’S MATH TEST. WE KNOW IT’S MORE THAN THIS, BUT LET’S SAY HERE’S THE SAMPLE OF STUDENTS WHO SCORED EXACTLY THE SAME PLACE JANE DID LAST YEAR IN THE ORANGE. OF COURSE THERE ARE MORE, BUT LET’S IMAGINE THERE ARE ONLY TEN. EACH OF THOSE STUDENTS SCORED A 301 ON LAST YEAR’S 3rd GRADE MATH TEST, AND HAVE NOW TAKEN THIS YEAR’S 4th GRADE MATH TEST AS WELL. WE CAN ORDER THESE STUDENTS BY THEIR SCORE ON THIS YEAR’S MATH TEST. SO REMEMBER, THEY ALL SCORED THE SAME ON LAST YEAR’S TEST, A 301. AND WE CAN ORDER THEM ON WHAT THEY SCORED ON THEIR 4th GRADE MATH TEST AND SEE THEIR SCORES HERE. WE CAN SEE JANE– AGAIN, EVERYONE SCORED THE SAME LAST YEAR BUT WE’RE ORDERING EVERYONE THERE– AND JANE SCORED A 434. THAT’S WHERE JANE FITS IN WITH THIS GROUP OF TEN PEERS THAT HAD COMPARABLE TEST SCORES LAST YEAR. WHAT THIS TELLS US IS THAT JANE HAD A STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILE OF 90, MEANING SHE DID BETTER THAN 90% OF STUDENTS ON THIS YEAR’S TEST, OF THOSE STUDENTS WHO SCORED EXACTLY THE SAME AS SHE DID LAST YEAR. WE CAN GO THROUGH THE SAME PROCESS FOR JOHN. WE HAVE A FEW STUDENTS WHO SCORED THE SAME PLACE JOHN DID LAST YEAR. AGAIN, LET’S IMAGINE THAT THERE ARE ONLY TEN. EACH OF THESE STUDENTS SCORED A 364 ON LAST YEAR’S 3rd GRADE MATH TEST. REMEMBER, JANE’S GROUP ALL SCORED 301. JOHN’S GROUP, BECAUSE JOHN SCORED HIGHER LAST YEAR, ALL SCORED 364. NOW THEY’VE TAKEN THIS YEAR’S TEST AND WE CAN ORDER THEM BY THEIR NEW SCORES. SO THIS IS JOHN’S COMPARISON GROUP, AND JOHN FITS IN HERE. SO EVEN THOUGH JOHN AND JANE HAD EXACTLY THE SAME SCORE ON THIS YEAR’S TEST, THEY HAD VERY DIFFERENT SCORES ON LAST YEAR’S, SO THEIR COMPARISON GROUPS ARE DIFFERENT. SO NOW WE CAN SAY THAT JOHN’S STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILE IS 20, WHICH MEANS JOHN SCORED BETTER THIS YEAR THAN 20% OF THE STUDENTS WHO SCORED EXACTLY THE SAME AS HE DID THE YEAR BEFORE. SO AGAIN, EVEN THOUGH JOHN AND JANE RECEIVED THE SAME SCORE ON THE 4th GRADE MATH TEST, LOOKING AT THEIR STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILES REVEALS THAT THEIR GROWTH IS VERY DIFFERENT AND THEIR ACADEMIC PROGRESS OVER THE LAST YEAR SIGNIFICANTLY SO. AGAIN, JOHN SCORED BETTER THAN 20% OF THE STUDENTS– ESSENTIALLY, THE AMOUNT OF LEARNING JOHN GAINED FROM LAST YEAR TO THIS YEAR IS ONLY BETTER THAN 20% OF THE STUDENTS WHO SCORED EXACTLY THE SAME AS HIM LAST YEAR. JANE’S IS BETTER THAN 90% OF THE STUDENTS WHO SCORED EXACTLY THE SAME AS HER LAST YEAR. SO STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILES DO DESCRIBE A STUDENT’S LEARNING OVER TIME COMPARED TO STUDENTS WITH EQUIVALENT PRIOR TEST SCORES. NOW, AN SGP OF 50 SHOWS AVERAGE LEARNING OVER TIME, WITH A HIGHER SGP SHOWING HIGHER THAN AVERAGE LEARNING AND VICE VERSA. IT’S PRETTY USEFUL AND POWERFUL TO UNDERSTAND THE AMOUNT OF LEARNING THAT A STUDENT GAINED OVER TIME COMPARED TO EVERYONE ELSE IN THE STATE. YOU CAN LOOK AT IT THIS WAY– 50 IS WHAT YOU CAN EXPECT ON AVERAGE ACROSS THE ENTIRE STATE, AND YOU’LL HAVE MORE THAN THAT FOR SOME STUDENTS AND LESS FOR OTHERS. STRENGTHS OF USING STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILES: THEY’RE MORE FAIR THAN OTHER MEASURES WHICH ASSUME THAT GROWTH IS EQUALLY LIKELY AT ANY ABILITY LEVEL. THIS HAS COME UP SEVERAL TIMES AT THE BOARD TABLE BEFORE, WHICH IS HOW CAN YOU HOLD PEOPLE ACCOUNTABLE FOR INDIVIDUAL STUDENT GROWTH? THE LEVEL OF GROWTH YOU’RE GOING TO SEE FROM ONE STUDENT TO ANOTHER IS GOING TO VARY BASED ON CERTAIN BACKGROUND VARIABLES, AND ONE RESPONSE I’VE GIVEN TO THAT IS THAT THAT’S CORRECT, THERE STILL ARE CORRELATIONS BETWEEN BACKGROUND CHARACTERISTICS AND INDIVIDUAL STUDENT GROWTH. HOWEVER, THE LEVEL OF– THE EXPLANATORY POWER OF THOSE BACKGROUND CHARACTERISTICS IS FAR, FAR LOWER FOR STUDENT GROWTH THAN IT IS FOR STUDENT ACHIEVEMENT. THAT’S ONE OF THE REASONS PEOPLE WANT TO MOVE AWAY FROM STATUS-BASED ACCOUNTABILITY TO IMPROVEMENT-BASED ACCOUNTABILITY, TO TAKE OUT THE IMPACT OF THOSE BACKGROUND CHARACTERISTICS. BUT THERE’S STILL A MINOR RELATION BETWEEN BACKGROUND CHARACTERISTICS AND STUDENT GROWTH IF YOU USE OTHER METRICS. WHAT THIS ONE DOES, HOWEVER, IS LEVEL THAT PLAYING FIELD. FOR EXAMPLE, IF YOU WERE TO TAKE WHAT SOME PEOPLE VIEW AS A TRUE GROWTH MEASURE AND JUST SUBTRACT THIS YEAR’S SCALE SCORE FROM LAST YEAR’S– OR LAST YEAR’S FROM THIS YEAR’S AND GET THE RESULT, YOU MIGHT BE ABLE TO SAY THAT JOHNNY GREW 10 POINTS AND MARY GREW 20 POINTS. BUT WHAT IF JOHN STARTED AT THE VERY TOP AND MARY AT THE VERY BOTTOM LAST YEAR? WHAT WE KNOW FROM STATISTICAL ANALYSES IS THAT YOU CAN GET VERY DIFFERENT EXPECTATIONS OF GROWTH FROM WHERE KIDS START OUT. WHAT THIS DOES IS ALLOW FOR LEVELLING THE PLAYING FIELD FOR KIDS WHO STARTED OUT HIGH VERSUS LOW, SO THAT WE’RE NOT DISADVANTAGING A TEACHER OR A SCHOOL OR A DISTRICT THAT PRIMARILY SERVES STUDENTS THAT SCORED LOW, VERSUS ANOTHER DISTRICT THAT PRIMARILY SERVES STUDENTS THAT SCORED HIGH. SO IT’S ESSENTIALLY SAYING THAT WE DON’T WANT TO SET DIFFERENTIAL EXPECTATIONS BASED ON WHERE YOU STARTED OUT, BUT WE HAVE TO BE REASONABLE. IT AT LEAST HAS TO BE OBSERVABLE. SO THIS ALLOWS US TO BUILD THAT INTO OUR MEASURE OF GROWTH, THAT WE’RE NOT GOING TO HARM SOMEONE BY HOLDING THE EXACT SAME EXPECTATION FOR DIFFERENT STUDENTS. AT LEAST IT’S OBSERVABLE, BUT NOT MAJOR DIFFERENCES FROM ONE TO THE OTHER. IT KEEPS US FROM DISADVANTAGING ONE GROUP, ONE TEACHER, ONE SCHOOL, ONE DISTRICT BECAUSE THEY HAPPEN TO SERVE A POPULATION THAT TENDS TO HAVE A SLIGHTLY LOWER GROWTH RATE THAN OTHERS. SO THAT’S WHAT’S NICE, AND AGAIN, YOU CAN IMPLEMENT STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILES EVEN IF YOU CHANGE THE TEST. THAT DOES NOT NECESSARILY MEAN THAT IT’S AS GOOD AS IF YOU DIDN’T CHANGE THE TEST, BUT YOU CAN STILL IMPLEMENT IT EVEN IF YOU CHANGE THE TEST, ESPECIALLY IF YOU HAVE HIGH CORRELATIONS BETWEEN LAST YEAR’S TEST AND THIS YEAR’S TEST AND YOU DON’T HAVE MAJOR CHANGES IN THE CONTENT. THAT’S THE SITUATION WE FIND OURSELVES IN. WE ANTICIPATE WE’LL HAVE VERY HIGH CORRELATIONS BETWEEN LAST YEAR’S AND THIS YEAR’S TESTS STILL, EVEN THOUGH IT’S A VERY DIFFERENT TEST. AND THE CONTENT ITSELF ISN’T CHANGING, JUST THE DEPTH OF KNOWLEDGE. SO THAT’S WHERE WE FIND OURSELVES, AND WE FEEL THIS WILL HELP US MAKE THE TRANSITION. ANOTHER REASON WE THINK THIS IS REALLY IMPORTANT IS GIVEN THAT THE LEGISLATURE TOLD US TO DEVELOP A NEW MEAP AND THEN TO ISSUE AN RFP FOR POTENTIALLY ANOTHER ONE, WE MAY HAVE THREE DIFFERENT TESTS IN THREE YEARS, AND WE NEED SOMETHING THAT CAN SURVIVE THAT TRANSITION.>>TWO THINGS. ONE WOULD BE JUST THAT YOU CAN SEE WHY WE’RE GOING TO MISS JOSEPH, AND WHY WE’RE ALSO LUCKY TO HAVE VANESSA WITH HER BACKGROUND READY TO JUST JUMP RIGHT IN. SECONDLY, THE CHARGE I GAVE TO THE GROUP WAS JUST– GIVEN THAT A LOT OF THIS IS GOING TO BE USED BY FOLKS FOR TEACHER EVALUATION, WHICH WE’RE STILL NOT COMFORTABLE WITH THE WAY THE LEGISLATURE JUMPED OUT ON THAT TOO EARLY, THE MAIN THING WAS FAIR. AND THIS, AS JOSEPH INDICATED, SHOWS WHY THAT’S A FAIRER SYSTEM POTENTIALLY THAN WHAT WAS HAPPENING BEFORE. IT INFORMS THAT FOR THOSE WHO NEED TO USE IT. IF I WERE A PRINCIPAL AND, LET’S SAY, I HAD A STUDENT WHOSE PARENT DIED THAT YEAR. FROM MY POINT, I HAVE A RIDICULOUS PERCENTAGE THAT I HAVE TO MEET ON AN EVALUATION. I MIGHT OFFSET THAT WITH THE OTHER PERCENTAGE THAT I’M ALLOWED TO HAVE SOME DISCRETION ON. I COULD SAY THAT MAYBE THAT’S NOT THE YEAR TO WORRY TOO MUCH ABOUT THE TEST. SO THERE’S WAYS TO EVEN– THAT’S NOT GAMING IT, BUT THERE’S WAYS TO TRY TO TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION SOME OF THESE OTHER DIFFERENT FACTORS. BUT GIVEN THAT MOST KIDS HAVE UPS AND DOWNS THAT WILL EVEN OUT. IN REALITY, THE TEN KIDS WILL PROBABLY AMOUNT TO– WELL, I KNOW MUCH LARGER, BUT–>>DEPENDING ON WHERE YOU– WELL, EVEN FOR THE RAREST OF SCORES, IT’S GOING TO BE HUNDREDS OF KIDS. AND FOR THE MOST COMMON SCORES, IT’S TENS OF THOUSANDS OF KIDS, AND I DO WANT TO SAY THAT THE UNDERLYING STATISTICS ARE PRETTY SOPHISTICATED, BUT THE CONCEPT IS NOT. YOU ACTUALLY BORROW STRENGTH FROM THE SCORES WHERE YOU HAVE LOTS AND LOTS OF KIDS TO INFORM THE ONES WHERE YOU DON’T HAVE AS MANY, SO AS TO STABILIZE THINGS MORE. IT’S ACTUALLY QUITE COMPLEX, BUT THE CONCEPT IS NOT, AND IT’S ACTUALLY QUITE HIGHLY CORRELATED WITH OTHER MEASURES OF GROWTH, BUT WE THINK IT’S ACTUALLY BETTER FOR THE SITUATION WE’RE IN.>>SUPPORT, JOHN?>>I HAD A FEW QUESTIONS. SO THIS IS VERY, VERY CLEVER, AND I THINK I GET IT. DOESN’T IT BREAK DOWN IF WHAT WE HOPE HAPPENS, WHICH IS EVERYBODY MAKES A BIG JUMP AND THERE’S NO RELATIVE DIFFERENCE, AND ALL THE TEACHERS ARE BEING EFFECTIVE? HOW DOES THAT NOT BREAK DOWN?>>THAT’S A REALLY GOOD QUESTION. I THINK IT’S THE SAME QUESTION THAT A TEACHER ASKED IN OUR EDUCATOR ADVISORY GROUP. SO IS THIS A FIXED PIE SYSTEM? YES, THE FIRST TIME YOU RUN IT, AND WHENEVER YOU CHANGE THE ASSESSMENT, BECAUSE YOU ESSENTIALLY HAVE TO RERUN IT THEN. BUT WHAT YOU CAN DO IS SET A BASELINE, SO ONCE WE’VE HAD A STABLE ASSESSMENT IN PLACE FOR 2 YEARS, THEN ESSENTIALLY, WHAT YOU’RE SAYING IS, “LET’S USE THE STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILE BASELINE FROM THOSE FIRST 2 YEARS THAT WE’VE HAD A STABLE ASSESSMENT SYSTEM, AND IF EVERYONE MOVES UP, THE MEDIAN STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILE ACROSS THE STATE CAN MOVE SIGNIFICANTLY OVER TIME.” SO THAT WOULD ESSENTIALLY BE OUR INTENT. WE HAVE TO HAVE SOMETHING THAT CAN SURVIVE THE TRANSITION AND ASSESSMENT, WHICH IS WHY I SAID IT’S NOT QUITE AS GOOD AS IF YOU’VE GOT THE SAME ASSESSMENT OVER TIME. IF YOU HAVE A STABLE ASSESSMENT SYSTEM OVER TIME, THEN YOU CAN SET A BASELINE, AND IN EFFECT, THERE’S NO REASON THAT EVERYONE COULDN’T BE ABOVE WHAT WOULD BE CONSIDERED AVERAGE. WE’D BE VERY HAPPY IF THAT WERE THE CASE IN TERMS OF EVERYONE BEING ABOVE THE BASELINE MEDIAN.>>IS ANYBODY ELSE DOING THIS?>>YES. THERE ARE TEN STATES IMPLEMENTING STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILES. IT IS WELL– ANOTHER REASON WE REALLY GRAVITATED TOWARDS STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILES BEING HELPFUL WAS THAT WE HAVE MORE CONVERSATIONS ABOUT INDIVIDUAL STUDENT GROWTH GOING ON IN STATES WITH STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILES– BECAUSE THE CONCEPT IS SO UNDERSTANDABLE– THAN ANY OTHER STATES WITH MORE COMPLEX METRICS. WE’VE STARTED HAVING MORE PEOPLE TALKING ABOUT THE PERFORMANCE LEVEL CHANGE, BUT WE’RE SEEING A LOT MORE SUCCESS WITH EDUCATORS, PARENTS, AND STUDENTS TALKING ABOUT STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILES IN THE STATES WHERE IT’S BEEN IMPLEMENTED.>>YES, OF COURSE. AND EVERY TIME THERE’S SOME SORT OF GROWTH MEASURE, SOMEBODY IS POINTING OUT SOME SORT OF FATAL FLAW OR CLAIMING IT’S FUNDAMENTALLY FLAWED. SO WHAT WOULD PEOPLE SAY IS THE FATAL FLAW IN THIS ONE?>>SO I THINK THE CONCERN PEOPLE HAVE AROUND THIS IS THAT IT’S NORMATIVE AT THE STUDENT LEVEL. SO YOU’RE GOING TO HAVE EXACTLY AS MANY STUDENTS IN EACH PERCENTILE, UNLESS YOU SET THE BASELINE. SO THE FIX FOR THAT IS YOU’VE GOT TO SET A BASELINE AT SOME POINT, AND IF YOU KEEP THAT BASELINE AND MOVE FORWARD, IT CEASES TO BE NORMATIVE AT THE STUDENT LEVEL. IT’S NORMATIVE AT THE STUDENT LEVEL FOR THE KIDS WHO FIRST TOOK IT, AND THEN IT MOVES TOWARDS SOMETHING WHERE EVERYONE CAN DEMONSTRATE ABOVE WHAT WAS AVERAGE IN THAT BASELINE YEAR.>>ONE OF THE– JUST TO ANSWER ANOTHER PART OF YOUR QUESTION. ONE OF THE STATES THAT’S BEEN DOING THIS FOR THE LONGEST IS COLORADO, AND THEY GET A LOT OF GOOD PRESS ON IT I FEEL LIKE, SO IF ANY OF YOU WANTED TO GO AND LOOK AT ANOTHER STATE THAT’S BEEN DOING IT FOR A GOOD– FIVE YEARS, PROBABLY? THAT’S ONE, AND THEY PUT OUT A LOT OF ANCILLARY MATERIALS, AS WELL.>>ALTHOUGH WE KNOW AFTER LAST YEAR’S POLICY, THOSE SCORES ARE GOING TO PLUMMET. [ LAUGHTER ] THANK YOU. EILEEN AND THEN RICHARD.>>ALL RIGHT, AND I JUST WANT TO SAY TO YOU THAT, HAVING SPENT MANY YEARS ON THE NATIONAL ASSESSMENT GOVERNING BOARD, WHERE THERE WERE THREE– COUNT THEM– THREE PEOPLE WHO KNEW WHAT JOSEPH KNEW, AND NONE OF THEM– WELL, MAYBE ONE– WAS ABLE TO BE AS ARTICULATE AND EASILY UNDERSTOOD AS JOSEPH.>>JOSEPH KNOWS HOW TO CONFIGURABLE THE WORDS. [ LAUGHTER ]>>SO AS YOU CUT TO THE CHASE, NOT TO LEAVE VANESSA HAVING TO HOLD THE BAG ON THIS IN A FEW MONTHS WHEN WE ASK HER, YOU SAID THERE’S A VERY HIGH CORRELATION BETWEEN YEARS. IS THAT BASED ON THE CONTENT OF THE ASSESSMENT, THE TYPES OF QUESTIONS THEY’RE BEING ASKED? THERE’S ALWAYS A BASE OF INFORMATION THAT SURVIVES THROUGH STANDARDS TRANSITIONS. SO THAT’S WHAT IT IS?>>IT’S BASED ON– SO OUR EXPECTATION IS BASED ON KNOWING THE KINDS OF QUESTIONS THAT WE’VE WRITTEN FOR MEAP, THE KINDS THAT WILL APPEAR ON M-STEP, AND THE OVERLAP IN CONTENT IN BOTH GRADE LEVEL AND HIGH SCHOOL, AND THE COMMON CORE, AND KNOWING THAT THERE’S A SHIFT IN THE DEPTH OF KNOWLEDGE, BUT ALSO KNOWING THAT THE– WHEN YOU LOOK AT DATA FROM MOST ACHIEVEMENT TESTS– NOT NECESSARILY APTITUDE TESTS. I’LL LEAVE THAT TO THE SIDE, BUT MOST ACHIEVEMENT TESTS, IF YOU GET DATA ON THEM, THEY’RE MEASURING THE SAME CONTENT AREA AND THEY HAVE REASONABLY SIMILAR STANDARDS, THE CORRELATIONS ARE HIGH ENOUGH THAT YOU CAN DO THIS.>>THANKS.>>RICHARD, PLEASE, THEN MELODY.>>I HAD A QUESTION AND THEN MAYBE JUST AN EXAMPLE YOU CAN COMMENT ON. MY QUESTION IS WHAT IMPLICATIONS, IF ANY, ARE THERE FOR THE SPREAD IN STUDENT ACHIEVEMENT? THAT IS TO SAY, SOME KIDS GO TO SCHOOLS EXTREMELY EFFECTIVE IN TEACHING MATH AND OTHERS ARE EXTREMELY INEFFECTIVE, SO YOU’VE GOT A BIG SPREAD IN THE SCORES OF THE KIDS WHO HAD THE SAME SCORE LAST YEAR. OR MAYBE EVERYONE’S EQUALLY EFFECTIVE IN TEACHING, AND SO THERE’S A SMALL SPREAD. I KNOW THAT YOU CAN ARRANGE THEM IN PERCENTILES EITHER WAY, BUT IS THERE– DOES THIS JUST COVER THAT UP, OR ARE THERE ANY IMPLICATIONS FOR THAT IN TERMS OF THIS MEASURE?>>YES. THIS– I’M GOING TO GO BACK TO SOMETHING THAT IS GENERIC ABOUT STUDENT GROWTH MEASUREMENT. IT’S SLIGHTLY LESS STABLE THAN STUDENT ACHIEVEMENT MEASUREMENT. SO YOU’RE GOING TO GET LESS STABLE MEASURES OUT OF GROWTH THAN YOU ARE OUT OF ACHIEVEMENT, WHICH IS ONE OF THE REASONS MOST PEOPLE TRYING TO DO EDUCATOR EVALUATION TRY TO SAY– YOU WANT TO LIMIT THE IMPACT OF INDIVIDUAL TEST SCORE DATA ON AN INDIVIDUAL EDUCATOR EVALUATION.>>RIGHT, RIGHT.>>SO HAVING SAID THAT, THIS IS SENSITIVE TO DIFFERENCES IN THE SAME KIND OF DIFFERENCES WE SEE ON OTHER GROWTH MEASURES. BEING ABLE TO SAY, “YEAH, I HAD ALL MY STUDENTS ABOVE AVERAGE.” WE’VE ACTUALLY HAD CASES WHERE SCHOOLS HAVE 80% OF THE STUDENTS RECEIVE AN SGP ABOVE 50. WOW, THAT’S REALLY SOMETHING IN A SCHOOL. AND OTHER SCHOOLS WERE 80% OF THE STUDENTS RECEIVING AN SGP BELOW 50, AND YOU SAY, “WELL, THAT SCHOOL IS NOT SHOWING THE KIND OF EFFECTIVENESS WE’D WANT TO SEE.” SO IT IS ABLE TO DISTINGUISH BETWEEN– IT MAY BE VERY TIGHT FOR ALL THE STUDENTS OR VERY DIVERSE BUT HIGH, TIGHT BUT LOW– YOU SEE ALL THOSE DIFFERENT PATTERNS FOR THIS METRIC AS YOU WOULD FOR OTHER TYPES OF GROWTH METRICS.>>AND IT JUST– TO CLARIFY, IF I UNDERSTAND YOU RIGHT, AND BECAUSE THOSE STUDENTS HAD THE SAME SCORE AT ONE POINT EARLIER, WE KNOW THAT IT’S NOT THE STUDENT’S– NOT PRIMARILY THE STUDENT’S ABILITY, BECAUSE AT ONE POINT, THEY WERE ALL PERFORMING ON THE SAME LEVEL. OKAY, OKAY.>>THE OTHER THING I WOULD JUST POINT OUT HERE– SO THERE’S ALWAYS A DEBATE ABOUT COMPARING STUDENTS WHO ARE SIMILAR IN OTHER TYPES OF CHARACTERISTICS AS WELL, AND THERE’S PROS AND CONS OF THAT, BECAUSE YOU DON’T WANT TO SET DIFFERENT EXPECTATIONS, BUT PRIOR ACHIEVEMENT SCORES ACTUALLY ENCAPSULATE A LOT OF THAT VARIATION. SO WHEN YOU HAVE A PRIOR ACHIEVEMENT SCORE, YOU’RE IN A BUCKET OF KIDS WHO ARE A LOT LIKE YOU IN A LOT OF WAYS ASIDE FROM ACHIEVEMENT SCORE. THIS SETS A REASONABLE COMPARISON GROUP WITHOUT EVEN GETTING INTO DEMOGRAPHICS, BUT IT DOES ACTUALLY PICK UP A LOT OF UNOBSERVED VARIANCE IN A KID. AND THAT’S A TRUTH FROM EDUCATIONAL RESEARCH AND OTHER THINGS, TOO. SO IT’S A REALLY GOOD PRE-MEASURE TO MAKE SURE WE’RE NOT HAVING SOMETHING ELSE HAPPEN HERE. AND THAT’S BUILT INTO THIS METHODOLOGY, TOO, TO GIVE YOU KIDS WHO ARE SIMILAR IN ACHIEVEMENT AND THEN ALSO IN OTHER WAYS.>>YOU KNOW, JUST TO–>>CAN I DO MY SECOND ITEM?>>YES, SIR, AND THEN I’M GOING TO DO A CONTEXT ISSUE.>>OKAY.>>BUT YES.>>FOR A WHILE, I TAUGHT 6, 7, 8 SPLIT IN DETROIT, ALL SUBJECTS. AND WE GAVE THE STANFORD ACHIEVEMENT TEST TO OUR KIDS, AND I HAD MORE THAN ONE BOY WHO DID OKAY IN 6th GRADE AND THEN TOOK– YOU KNOW, A LOT OF KIDS HAVE ATTITUDE PROBLEMS IN 7th GRADE, AND THE 7th GRADE SCORES SHOWED NO– ALMOST NO ACHIEVEMENT WHATSOEVER, AND THEN THEY KIND OF STRAIGHTEN OUT BY 8th GRADE, AND THEN THEY GOT A MORE– WHAT I WOULD SAY IS A MORE TRUE READING, AND THAT SHOWED LIKE 2 YEARS OF GROWTH. AND MY OWN IMPRESSION AND OPINION WAS IT PROBABLY– THE 7th GRADE SCORE DIDN’T– BECAUSE HE HAD A LOUSY ATTITUDE TOWARD THE TEST– DIDN’T DEMONSTRATE EVERYTHING HE LEARNED THAT YEAR. ON THE OTHER HAND, THE 8th GRADE SCORE WAS PROBABLY MORE TRUSTWORTHY IN TERMS OF HIS ACTUAL ACHIEVEMENT. NOW, I SUPPOSE THE STUDENT GROWTH MEASURE AVERAGES OUT OVER TIME ON AN INDIVIDUAL STUDENT. I DON’T KNOW IF THERE ARE OTHER IMPLICATIONS TO THAT, LIKE KIDS WHO SEEM TO SHOW NO GROWTH IN ONE YEAR– AND THERE ARE PLATEAUS AND– I FORGET WHAT YOU CALL THE CLIMB, WHERE KIDS REALLY LEARN A LOT IN A SHORT PERIOD OF TIME. THERE ARE THOSE KINDS OF PATTERNS OBSERVED IN LEARNING, TOO.>>YEAH, THAT IS SOMETHING WE TEND TO SEE, AND I THINK THAT’S ALSO ONE OF THE REASONS WHY A– PARTICULARLY WITH INDIVIDUAL STUDENT GROWTH, BECAUSE IT IS LESS STABLE THAN ACHIEVEMENT. BECAUSE WITH ACHIEVEMENT, YOU HAVE MEASUREMENT ERROR ON WHAT YOU JUST MEASURED. WITH GROWTH, YOU HAVE MEASUREMENT ERROR ON LAST YEAR’S MEASUREMENT. THAT’S WHY IT’S LESS STABLE.>>OKAY.>>I THINK THE ISSUE IS THOSE THINGS DO AVERAGE OUT OVER TIME, BUT BECAUSE IT’S LESS STABLE THAN ACHIEVEMENT METRICS, THAT’S ONE REASON PEOPLE THINK IT’S REALLY IMPORTANT TO PUT A STANDARD ERROR AROUND WHAT YOU IDENTIFY FOR AN INDIVIDUAL CLASSROOM OR SCHOOL, SO YOU’RE GETTING MUCH MORE OF A SENSE OF HOW CERTAIN WE ARE ABOUT THE AGGREGATE LEVEL OF GROWTH IN THIS CLASSROOM OR SCHOOL. SO THAT BECOMES EVEN MORE IMPORTANT WHEN YOU DO STUDENT GROWTH MEASUREMENT, AND IT’S SOMETHING YOU CAN GET OUT OF THIS REASONABLY EASILY.>>AND IT’S ALSO A PIECE– MIKE, I KNOW YOU’RE TRYING TO SAY SOMETHING– SORRY. IT’S ALSO– [ LAUGHTER ] YOU’RE RIGHT THAT THAT 7th GRADE STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILE MIGHT SAY, “HE DIDN’T GROW MUCH.” AND MAYBE THAT WAS BECAUSE HE THOUGHT THAT SCHOOL IS STUPID AND HE DIDN’T WANT TO TAKE THE TEST. BUT WHEN YOU TAKE THE INDIVIDUAL STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILE AND USE IT FOR A TEACHER OR SCHOOL OR DISTRICT, THAT’S WHY WE USE MULTI-YEAR AVERAGING OR THINGS TO TRY TO– MORE DATA TO ACCOUNT FOR–>>RIGHT, THE ERRORS CANCEL EACH OTHER OUT, YEAH.>>YOU TRY TO MINIMIZE IT BY HAVING MORE INFORMATION IN THERE.>>IT’S VERY NICE, THE WAY PEOPLE ARE MORE POLITE TO ME IN FRONT OF YOU WHEN THEY KIND OF– BECAUSE IN SUP’S GROUP, IT’S JUST RUN RIGHT OVER HIM, “DON’T CARE WHAT YOU THINK, MIKE.” [ LAUGHTER ] IT’S NOT THAT THEY DON’T CARE WHAT I THINK. IT’S THAT THEY KNOW WE CAN HAVE A FULL, ROBUST DISCUSSION AND KIND OF DON’T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT EACH OTHER’S FEELINGS ON IT. I DO WANT TO JUST ADD CONTEXT FOR A MINUTE. YOU KNOW HOW THEY OFTEN SAY THAT THE CONGRESS SEEMS– CAN’T GET ANYTHING DONE, OR OUR SYSTEM IS A BIG PROBLEM, BUT THEN WE USUALLY FOLLOW UP WITH, “WELL, COMPARED TO ALL THE OTHER SYSTEMS, IT’S THE BEST ONE AROUND.” IT’S A LITTLE BIT OF THIS GOING ON HERE. I MEAN, IT’S COMPARED TO WHAT? RIGHT OR WRONG, WE’RE IN A HIGH ACCOUNTABILITY FEDERAL AND STATE ATMOSPHERE. CHAPTER 11 IN MY BOOK WILL BE WHY THAT SHOULD AND WILL GO SOMEDAY. WE’LL HAVE OUTLIVED THIS. THIS IS JUST KIND OF THE QUIRK OF THE TIME, BECAUSE ULTIMATELY, WHAT YOU’RE GOING TO WANT IS FOR A TEACHER TO HAVE THAT INFORMATION THAT THEY WOULD WANT TO KNOW SO I CAN ADJUST AND FIGURE OUT WHY I’M AT THE 20th PERCENTILE AND OTHERS ARE AT THE 80– WHAT ARE YOU DOING TO GET– THAT’S WHERE THIS WILL GO BACK, BUT FOR NOW, WE’RE NOT IN THAT. FOR NOW, WE’RE IN HAVING TO COME UP WITH STUFF THAT’S GOING TO MEET THE FEDS AND GET A WAIVER RENEWED, WHICH IS IN ALL OF OUR INTERESTS, BUT PRETTY MUCH WHAT MICHELLE WAS SAYING EARLIER, AND I VERY MUCH AGREE. WE’VE JUST GONE OVER BONKERS ON THIS WHOLE THING, AND IT’S LIKE EVERYONE KEEPS TRYING TO OUTDO EACH OTHER ON “I CAN BE TOUGHER.” I THINK THERE MIGHT EVEN BE A LITTLE BULLYING GOING ON HERE. INCLUDE THAT IN YOUR BOOK. NOT HERE HERE, BUT– I THINK MELODY WAS NEXT, AND THEN DAN.>>I REALLY LIKE THIS MODEL, AND I THINK THAT FOCUSING IN GROWTH IS SO MUCH MORE IMPORTANT THAN ACHIEVEMENT, ALL THE TIME. I DO WONDER ABOUT THE KIDS WHO ARE STRUGGLERS OR WHO ARE BELOW GRADE LEVEL. IT USED TO BE THE IDEA THAT EVERY STUDENT SHOULD MAKE ONE YEAR’S WORTH OF GROWTH, AND THEN NOW, ESSENTIALLY, A STUDENT WHO IS BEHIND WOULD HAVE TO MAKE MORE THAN A YEAR’S GROWTH TO CATCH UP. SO I JUST WONDER IF THOSE STUDENTS ARE SHOWING A PRETTY DECENT PERCENTILE, IF THAT MIGHT BE MISLEADING TO THEIR FAMILY OR PEOPLE WHO ARE MAKING DECISIONS THAT WILL HELP MOVE THEM ALONG. I GUESS IT’S JUST GOING TO HAVE TO BE MOVING FROM THIS OLD WAY OF THINKING TO A NEW STYLE, BUT I WORRY THAT IT MIGHT BE MISLEADING FOR THOSE KIDS THAT– THE NUMBERS DON’T NECESSARILY MATCH UP WITH WHAT THEY NEED.>>I THINK WHAT YOU’RE SAYING IS IT’S THE IMPORTANCE OF STILL USING PROFICIENCY DATA, BECAUSE GROWTH, IF IT’S NOT GETTING LINKED TO PROFICIENCY AT SOME POINT, IS NOT ENOUGH. IT’S– JOSEPH HAS TALKED A LOT ABOUT THIS OVER THE PAST YEAR, BUT THERE’S GROWTH, WHICH YOU NEED TO ACCOUNT FOR AND REWARD, BUT THERE’S GROWTH TOWARD A STANDARD, TOO, AND OUR STANDARD NEEDS TO BE PROFICIENCY. IT CAN’T JUST BE ANY GROWTH. AT THE SAME TIME, WE WANT TO REWARD LEGITIMATE GROWTH IN KIDS WHO ARE WAY BELOW PROFICIENCY AND PROGRESSING TOWARDS THAT. SO I THINK YOU’RE RIGHT ABOUT HELPING THE PARENT, TEACHER, EVERYBODY UNDERSTAND THE POSITIVES, BUT ALSO IN THE CONTEXT OF WHERE THE STUDENT STILL HAS TO GO. SO IT’S NOT, “OH, THEIR GROWTH PERCENTILE IS AT 50. THEY’RE DONE.” WELL, NO. THEY’RE NOT PROFICIENT.>>EVEN IF YOU LOOK AT THE METRICS THAT WERE UP HERE, YOU COULD THANK THE TEACHER FOR THAT REMARKABLE GROWTH, BUT REMEMBER THAT THEY’RE STILL NOT PROFICIENT. YOU NOTICE THE TAGLINE OVER ON PROFICIENT– RAW NUMBER. SO YOU HAVE THE BEST OF BOTH WORLDS, IN ONE SENSE, BECAUSE THIS SHOULD BE REWARDED FOR GROWTH, EVEN THOUGH IT’S GOING TO BE A HEAVIER LIFT FOR A WHILE.>>SO THE– GETTING BACK TO JOHN’S ORIGINAL QUESTION, ONCE YOU HAVE A STABLE ASSESSMENT IN PLACE FOR AT LEAST 2 YEARS, YOU CAN IDENTIFY WHAT’S CALLED IN THE LITERATURE ADEQUATE GROWTH PERCENTILE TO GET YOU TO PROFICIENCY WITHIN 4, 5, 6 YEARS. SO FOR 3rd GRADE, IF YOU WERE TO DEMONSTRATE THE SAME TYPE OF GROWTH THAT YOU DID LAST YEAR, YOU WOULD BE PROFICIENT BY 7th GRADE. SO YOU HAVE A KIND OF PROJECTION THAT CAN BE BUILT INTO THIS KIND OF MODEL. WE’RE JUST NOT AT THE PLACE WHERE WE CAN DO IT YET, BUT IT’S POSSIBLE.>>PLUS, IT’S NOT AS DEMORALIZING. I MEAN, RIGHT NOW, IT’S LIKE, THIS IS GOING TO TAKE YOU FOREVER, AND NO THANKS IN THERE FOR THE PROGRESS THAT’S BEEN MADE, RELATIVE TO KIDS WHO STARTED OUT THE SAME WAY. THEN YOU HAVE FOLKS LIKE YOURSELF AND MY DAUGHTER WHO ARE SITTING OUT THERE, AND IT’S HARD NOT TO BE DEMORALIZED IF YOU’RE THINKING, “I’M DOING A GOOD JOB, I’M JUST NOT QUITE THERE,” AND THEN YOU GIVE THEM THAT RICH DATA THAT GIVES THEM BOTH INSIGHTS. I THINK IT WAS DAN, THEN KATHLEEN, THEN MICHELLE.>>SO I HAD EIGHT THINGS.>>WHOA!>>BUT VANESSA KNOCKED ONE OF THEM OFF THE LIST, SO I’D LIKE TO ASK THREE QUESTIONS AND THEN GET BACK IN THE QUEUE. ALL RIGHT.>>YEAH, I NOTICED YOU MOVED AWAY FROM LUPE. [ LAUGHTER ]>>AND SHE KICKED ME SO HARD, I ACTUALLY FORGOT THAT FIRST ONE. SO THE FIRST QUESTION IS– WOULD YOU BE RECOMMENDING THIS IF THE ASSESSMENT REGIME WAS STABLE?>>YES, AND THE REASON IS THE LEVELLING OF THE PLAYING FIELD FOR TEACHERS AND INSTITUTIONS THAT ARE SERVING PRIMARILY LOW PERFORMING STUDENTS. EVEN THOUGH THE DIFFERENCES IN AVERAGE GROWTH RATES ON OTHER METRICS ARE MINOR, WHEN YOU AGGREGATE THEM, YOU CAN SEE A DISADVANTAGE TO AN EDUCATOR OF A CERTAIN TYPE OF STUDENTS. SO YES, WE WOULD BE RECOMMENDING THIS EVEN IF THE ASSESSMENT WERE STABLE.>>AND BECAUSE IT GETS US TO GROWTH IN SCIENCE AND SOCIAL STUDIES, AND IN HIGH SCHOOL. AND AS AN ACCOUNTABILITY GIRL AT HEART, IT’S HARD TO KNOW THAT THE SYSTEM RIGHT NOW DOESN’T HAVE GROWTH ANYWHERE IN THERE BUT READING AND MATH IN ELEMENTARY AND MIDDLE SCHOOL.>>SO THAT ACTUALLY GETS ME TO MY SECOND QUESTION, WHICH IS WHY WAS THIS– OH, FOR HIGH SCHOOL, I GET WHY IT WOULDN’T HAVE BEEN AVAILABLE. SO THIS– STUDENT GROWTH PERCENTILES WERE CERTAINLY AVAILABLE FOR THE MEAP, YES?>>SO THEY ARE A RELATIVELY NEW ADDITION TO THE STUDENT GROWTH METRIC LIBRARY. SO WE’VE BEEN KIND OF WATCHING THIS AND KNOWING WE HAD TO DEVELOP SOMETHING NEW, SO TAKING ADVANTAGE OF THE SHIFT IN ASSESSMENT FELT LIKE A GOOD TIME TO MAKE A SHIFT IN THE METRIC.>>BUT WE COULD HAVE USED IT–>>WE COULD’VE USED IT 2 OR 3 YEARS AGO, MAYBE.>>OKAY, ALL RIGHT.>>BUT NOBODY KNEW WHAT IT WAS THEN. [ LAUGHTER ]>>THIRD QUESTION, AND THEN I’LL GET BACK IN THE QUEUE. SO MAYBE A LITTLE MORE PROCEDURAL. SO WE WANT TO SUBMIT THIS TO THE DOE WHEN?>>WELL, THE TIMELINE ON THE FLEX RENEWAL PACKAGE– WE JUST GOT GUIDANCE THIS LAST WEEK, WHICH WAS GREAT. THE TIMELINE FOR SUBMISSION IS MARCH 1st, THE WHOLE PACKAGE HAS TO GO IN. THAT INCLUDES A LOT MORE THAN THIS, BUT THIS WOULD BE A PIECE THAT WOULD GO FORWARD. I’VE ACTUALLY– I’M NOT SURE THEY HAVE TO APPROVE THIS AS PART OF THAT. BUT WE’D TALK ABOUT HOW WE– I HAVE TO DOUBLE-CHECK THAT, BUT WE’D TALK ABOUT HOW WE’RE GOING TO USE IT IN THE ACCOUNTABILITY SYSTEM OR ED EVALS, BUT I DON’T KNOW THAT THEY’RE GOING TO DO A SPECIFIC REVIEW OF GROWTH FOR US.>>OKAY, BUT WE DO HAVE TO HAVE A WHOLE SYSTEM APPROVED?>>YEAH.>>OKAY, KATHLEEN, MICHELLE, THEN BACK TO DAN.>>–SYSTEM WHAT? OH, OKAY.>>KATHLEEN?>>OH, THANKS. WELL, THERE’S BEEN SO MUCH CRITICISM OF STUDENT GROWTH AS A MEASURE OF TEACHER– BECAUSE IT’S GOING TO BE USED FOR TEACHER EVALUATION, EVENTUALLY.>>YEAH, IT WOULD LIKELY BE. SO IT WOULD NOT BE MANDATORY TO USE IN THIS WAY. SENATE BILL 817 ACTUALLY DELAYED THE MANDATED USE OF STATE ASSESSMENT GROWTH DATA BY 1 YEAR, BUT IT COULD BE USED AT THE DISCRETION OF THE LOCAL DISTRICT. THIS IS ONE WAY WHERE IF THEY’RE GOING TO BE USING SOMETHING FROM STATE ASSESSMENT DATA, THIS IS LIKELY THE MOST DEFENSIBLE THING WE CAN PROVIDE.>>AND AGAIN, WE FEEL, EVEN FOR THAT, IF THEY NEED TO USE SOMETHING FROM STATE ASSESSMENT DATA, IT GIVES US GROWTH DATA ON MORE KIDS, IT’S FEWER NON-TESTED GRADES AND SUBJECTS. THAT HELPS. MORE TEACHERS HAVE MORE DATA AVAILABLE. SO RECOGNIZING THE CONCERNS AROUND GROWTH DATA–>>SO THIS IS A MORE RELIABLE MEASURE THAN THE TRADITIONAL STUDENT GROWTH–>>YOU’RE SAYING IT WAS FAIRER, TOO, BECAUSE– IT’S FAIRER TO TEACHERS WHO ARE ANXIOUS– “MY KIDS ARE JUST LOW PERFORMERS. I SHOULDN’T BE– THEY HAVE A HARD TIME LEARNING BECAUSE THEY’VE GOT ISSUES AT HOME.” SO THIS, YOU’RE ARGUING, IS FAIRER TO THEM.>>THAT’S WHY I WAS SAYING THE CHARGE WAS–>>–COMPARES RELATIVE MOVEMENT TO SIMILAR POOR KIDS.>>OR KIDS WHO SCORED THE SAME. WE DON’T KNOW IT’D BE THAT–>>DID YOU– WHO DREAMED UP THIS SYSTEM?>>HIS NAME IS DAMIAN BETEBENNER. [ LAUGHTER ]>>OF COURSE IT IS. NO. [ LAUGHTER ]>>LET ME GUESS: HE’S A PSYCHOMETRICIAN.>>YES.>>THIS IS LIKE THE SORT OF URBAN LEGEND OF MEASUREMENT PROGRAMS, THAT YOU WOULD SOMEDAY TAKE ALL OF YOUR TRAINING AND DREAM UP SOMETHING THAT EVERYBODY STARTS USING. [ OVERLAPPING CHATTER ]>>KATHLEEN, ARE YOU DONE?>>YEAH.>>OKAY. MICHELLE?>>MY QUESTION IS HOW DO YOU CONTROL– BECAUSE I’M READING– THE AMERICAN STATISTICAL ASSOCIATION COMES OUT AND SAYS THAT THESE ARE NOT RELIABLE AND NOT VALID, SO– AS GROWTH MEASURES– MAYBE NOT FOR THE STUDENTS, BUT NOT NECESSARILY FOR THE TEACHER, TO USE THEM AS EVALUATIONS FOR TEACHERS. AND EVEN THOUGH I’M HEARING WHAT YOU SAY ABOUT BEING FAIRER– AND SO SOME OF THE ISSUES THAT– BUT MAYBE THERE’S THINGS THAT ARE BEING CONTROLLED: ABSENTEEISM– IS THERE A CONTROL FOR THAT? IS THERE A CONTROL FOR– WELL, I GUESS A LOT OF THIS STUFF IS TIED TO ABSENTEEISM, BUT LIKE WHEN KIDS ARE MORE TRANSIENT, THEY’RE MOVING, THEY HAVE MORE THAN ONE TEACHER– HOW DO YOU HOLD– WHICH TEACHERS YOU HOLD ACCOUNTABLE FOR THAT, AND IF THERE’S TEACHER TURNOVER, HOW DO YOU HOLD THESE THINGS ACCOUNTABLE? SO SOME OF THE EXTERNAL FACTORS THAT AFFECT FOLKS AND… HAVE BEEN CRITICIZED BY THE AMERICAN STATISTICAL ASSOCIATION AS– YOU KNOW, THESE EXTERNAL THINGS FROM SCHOOL HAVING AN IMPACT, AND THEN TRYING TO USE THAT TO MEASURE THE WORTH OF A TEACHER. IS THERE ANY EXTRA STUFF IN THERE–>>YES, SO THE MCE WAS VERY CONCERNED ABOUT THAT AND MADE A RECOMMENDATION THAT IF A STUDENT IS NOT THERE 90% OF THE TIME, THAT STUDENT’S DATA DOES NOT GO INTO AN EVALUATION.>>NINETY PERCENT?>>RIGHT.>>YEAH, SO HE’S 10% IN SCHOOL.>>IF A STUDENT IS NOT THERE 90% OF THE TIME, THEN THEY– THE DATA IS HELD OUT.>>IF THEY’RE THERE LESS THAN 90–>>RIGHT, LESS THAN 90% OF THE TIME.>>CORRECT, THANK YOU. IF THEY’RE THERE LESS THAN 90– IF THEIR ATTENDANCE RATE IS LESS THAN 90%, THEN THE DATA SHOULD BE HELD OUT. THAT DID NOT MAKE IT INTO THE LEGISLATION, AS I RECALL, BUT IT’S SOMETHING THAT’S UP TO LOCAL DISTRICTS TO BE ABLE TO DO. AND I MIGHT SET THAT THRESHOLD A LITTLE HIGHER, SIMPLY BECAUSE 10% OF A SCHOOL YEAR IS 18 DAYS, AND THAT’S KIND OF A LOT TO MISS. SO IT REALLY IS UP TO THE LOCAL DISTRICT TO TALK ABOUT WHEN YOU HOLD STUDENT DATA OUT AND WHEN YOU KEEP IT IN. THERE– WHAT?>>WELL, I WAS GOING TO SAY THAT YOU KIND OF ASKED TWO QUESTIONS. ONE IS DOES THE SCORE ITSELF, I THINK IS WHAT YOU’RE ASKING, ACCOUNT FOR ANY ABSENTEEISM OR ANYTHING ABOUT A STUDENT. THAT’S WHERE I’D GO BACK TO WHAT I ANSWERED FOR DR. ZEILE’S QUESTION, THAT WHEN YOU TAKE STUDENTS WHO SCORED SIMILARLY, THE PRIOR YEAR SCORE HOLDS A LOT OF INFORMATION ABOUT A STUDENT THAT– THINGS LIKE A LOW TEST SCORE INDICATE THAT THEY’RE PROBABLY ABSENT A LOT, SO IT PUTS THEM IN A COMPARISON GROUP OF OTHER KIDS WHO HAVE LOW TEST SCORES FOR A VARIETY OF REASONS. SO THE SCORE ITSELF DOES A BETTER JOB OF ADJUSTING FOR THINGS THAT ARE HARD TO OBSERVE AROUND THE KID. BUT THEN YOU’RE ALSO ASKING ABOUT USE, WHICH IS WHAT JOSEPH WAS GETTING INTO. SO YOU CAN HAVE THE SGPs, BUT HOW YOU USE THEM TO EVALUATE A TEACHER, YOU NEED STANDARDS AROUND WHEN DO YOU HOLD A STUDENT’S SCORE OUT, BUT ALSO WHAT MIKE WAS SAYING– WHEN DO YOU HAVE DISCRETION AS A PRINCIPLE TO FIGURE IN THEIR OBSERVATIONAL CHARACTERISTICS OR OTHER PROFESSIONAL PRACTICES AS GREATER THAN THE TEST SCORE. AND SO WE THINK– AGAIN, KIND OF PARSING THE TWO– THE CONVERSATION AROUND EXACTLY HOW THE EVALUATION SYSTEM WILL COME OUT IS STILL EVOLVING IN THE LEGISLATURE AND HERE, AND MIKE HAS EXPRESSED A LOT OF VIEWS ABOUT THAT, AS WELL. BUT THE CORE GROWTH MEASURE HELPS MORE WITH WHAT YOU’RE TALKING ABOUT THAN PREVIOUS GROWTH MEASURES, ALTHOUGH IT’S NEVER GOING TO DO EVERYTHING.>>DAN, WE’RE BACK TO YOU.>>RIGHT. [ LAUGHTER ]>>HOW MANY DO YOU HAVE LEFT?>>FOUR. SO– [ LAUGHTER ]>>RIGHT NOW.>>IS THERE SOMETHING TO STAB MYSELF WITH HERE?>>ACTUALLY, JOHN, YOU TOOK ONE OF THEM, SO IT’S THREE.>>ALL RIGHT!>>YEAH, ONE, TWO, THREE.>>I’M FOCUSED, SO I’M TAKING ANOTHER ONE RIGHT NOW. [ LAUGHTER ]>>LUPE’S GETTING CLOSER, TOO. SHE’S GOING TO–>>MAYBE YOU CAN CHANNEL DAN NEXT YEAR FOR US.>>SO THE PEER GROUP– TWO QUESTIONS ABOUT THIS. IT’S ESSENTIALLY TWO QUESTIONS, SO YOU’LL TAKE TWO QUESTIONS IN ONE. THE PEER GROUP FROM LAST YEAR, ALL OF WHOM HAVE THE SAME SCORE AS ME, ALL HAVE TO HAVE BEEN IN THE SAME GRADE, YES?>>YES.>>OKAY, SO WE’RE NOT TALKING ABOUT A PEER GROUP, LIKE– SO A HIGH PERFORMING 3rd GRADER WILL NOT END UP IN THE SAME GROUP AS A LOW PERFORMING 5th GRADER. OKAY. AND THE SAME THING IS TRUE OF THE CURRENT YEAR, THEN? SO THAT’S MY PEER GROUP, AND– GOT IT. OKAY. SECOND, THE– I THINK YOU TOOK THIS ONE ALREADY, VANESSA, SO WE’RE GOOD THERE. AND THEN LASTLY– SO MAYBE THE LAST THING IS A POINT. I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE– SO I COMPLETELY UNDERSTAND THAT MANY OF US HAVE CHALLENGES WITH HOW DATA GETS USED AND HOW THESE ASSESSMENTS GET USED, LIKE WHAT WE USE THEM FOR IN OUR ACCOUNTABILITY AND SO FORTH. I JUST WANT TO BE CLEAR, LIKE– I WANT TO TRY AND DRAW A REALLY BRIGHT LINE BETWEEN THE ASSESSMENTS AND THE DATA THEMSELVES, AND HOW THEY GET USED. WE CAN CRITIQUE HOW THEY GET USED ALL DAY LONG, AND I WORRY SOMETIMES THAT WE, IN THE PROCESS OF DOING THAT, ARE ACTUALLY CRITIQUING THE DATA, THE ASSESSMENT ITSELF. AND FOR AS LONG AS TEACHERS HAVE BEEN EDUCATING KIDS, WE’VE BEEN USING ASSESSMENTS. LIKE YOU ACTUALLY HAVE TO, I THINK, IN ORDER TO KNOW WHAT TO TEACH A YOUNG PERSON, RIGHT? LIKE, DID YOU GET THIS? IT’S NOT THE ASSESSMENT THAT’S THE PROBLEM, ALTHOUGH SOMETIMES IT’S THE PROBLEM OR CHALLENGE. IT’S HOW WE USE IT SOMETIMES THAT IS THE CHALLENGE, AND TRYING TO MAKE THE ASSESSMENT GOOD ENOUGH TO USE IN CERTAIN WAYS THAT’S REALLY THE NUT OF THE CHALLENGE THAT WE’RE TRYING TO GET TO IN A LOT OF THESE CONVERSATIONS. I JUST WANT TO BE CLEAR THAT THAT’S NOT THE SAME AS THE ASSESSMENT ITSELF. WE NEED TO BE ADMINISTERING ASSESSMENTS, I THINK. THEY’RE GOING TO BE ADMINISTERED REGARDLESS, EVEN IF THE STATES DIDN’T REQUIRE IT. TEACHERS WOULD STILL BE ADMINISTERING TESTS AND QUIZZES AND SO ON. SO I JUST– I THINK IT’S REALLY CAREFUL AS WE ENTER THIS NEXT STAGE FOR THE NEXT COUPLE OF YEARS, AND I WON’T BE WITH YOU GUYS WHEN YOU DO IT, BUT JUST TO BE REALLY CAREFUL WITH OUR LANGUAGE, SO THAT WE’RE NOT CRITIQUING THE ASSESSMENT NEGATIVELY. IF WE ARE CRITIQUING SOMETHING NEGATIVELY, IT’S WHAT WE’RE USING THE ASSESSMENT FOR, BECAUSE IT’S ILL-SUITED FOR THAT PARTICULAR PURPOSE, IF AND WHEN IT IS.>>THAT’S A GREAT OBSERVATION, AND WE THINK, BY THE WAY, THIS IS ON A TRACK FOR CONTINUOUS IMPROVEMENT, REALLY, OF THE ASSESSMENT ITSELF. SO WE SHOULD BE MORE PROUD OF IT THAN THE LAST TIME. AND I– EXCUSE ME? AND I THINK YOU– THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE TALKED ABOUT ONE TIME HERE AND IT GOT– I THINK– I DON’T THINK I COMMUNICATED IT VERY WELL, BUT I’M GOING TO TRY AGAIN. WE HAVE LESS COMPLAINTS ABOUT WHAT WE DO WITH STUDENT ASSESSMENT THAN WITH ADULT ASSESSMENT. SO I THINK I SHARED MY OWN CREDENTIALS A MOMENT AGO ABOUT WHY I DON’T THINK THIS SHOULD BE WHAT WE DO WITH TEACHERS. I THINK IT’LL STAY AND THEN PROFESSIONALS WILL USE IT FOR ALL THE RIGHT REASONS. “I BELIEVE THAT TEST IS A GOOD ONE, AND WONDER WHY I’M AT THE 20th PERCENTILE AND NOT 80. I’M GOING TO–” BUT I ALSO HAVE ON MY WALL– WHEN I SPOKE AT THE SOCIAL STUDIES CONFERENCE A WEEK AGO, I FORGOT I HAVE A FREDERICK DOUGLASS BOOK– AN ORIGINAL. AND I FORGOT TO BRING IT IN, BECAUSE I WAS GOING TO MAKE A POINT WITH IT. SO I GRABBED MY OLD SOCIAL STUDIES BOOK, WHICH I HAPPEN TO HAVE IN MY MINI LIBRARY HERE, AND FOR THE FIRST TIME, IT OPENED UP WITH A POP QUIZ OF MIKEY FLANAGAN IN BROOKLYN, 50%. AND I HAVE TO TELL YOU, IT BROUGHT ME RIGHT BACK. I REMEMBER BEING DEVASTATED BY THAT. SO I HAVE IT UP ON MY WALL. WHAT I’M GETTING AT IS WE APPROPRIATELY OBSESS. I SAID RIGHT AT THE BEGINNING, OUR CHARGE WAS MAKE THIS FAIR SO WHEN IT’S USED FOR TEACHERS, THEY’RE TREATED FAIRLY ON THIS. ON THE OTHER HAND, WE DO THINGS EVERY DAY THAT ALSO DESERVES DISCUSSION– PROBABLY IN OTHER FORUMS, NOT NECESSARILY AT A STATE BOARD LEVEL. AND TO ME, THAT’S TROUBLING. WE HAVE KIDS THAT ARE TOTALLY KNOCKED OUT OF THE CAGE BEFORE THEY EVEN START BECAUSE THEY FEEL THEY’RE NOT TREATED FAIRLY IN THE WAY A CLASSROOM ASSESSMENT IS BEING DONE OR HOW THEY’RE BEING MEASURED. SO I THINK IN A WAY, THIS IS A GOOD THING, BECAUSE THE MORE THAT PEOPLE CAN FEEL IT FOR THEMSELVES– IN THIS CASE, TEACHERS AND ADMINISTRATORS AND ME– YOU’RE MORE SENSITIVE TO THE WAY YOU MAY BE DOING THINGS TO OTHER PEOPLE. IT’S KIND OF LIKE A WAKE UP CALL, LIKE, “YOU KNOW, I DON’T LIKE BEING TREATED UNFAIRLY, AND I WONDER IF I’M INDIRECTLY DOING THAT MYSELF.” JUST A THOUGHT TO BUILD ON YOUR POINT. BUT THE ASSESSMENTS WE’RE PROUD OF, AND WE THINK THIS IS THE RIGHT DIRECTION, AND IT SEEMS LIKE THE BOARD IS– ARE THERE ANY FINAL– BEFORE WE BRING MARTY UP? WELL, THANK YOU. THIS WAS VERY HELPFUL.>>MMM-HMM.>>VANESSA, YOU’RE STARTING TO SOUND LIKE HIM. [ LAUGHTER ]>>IF YOU REMEMBER, JOSEPH HIRED ME INTO THE DEPARTMENT.>>DAN, YOU AND I CAN SIT IN THE BACK OF THE ROOM, HERE. IT’S NOT LIKE WE’RE– IN SOME WAYS, WITH A NICE, CRISP, 3- OR 5-MINUTE SPEECH, WE COULD MAYBE ACCOMPLISH MORE THAN WHAT– YES, MA’AM.>>BEFORE YOU START, I’M GOING TO HAVE TO LEAVE IN ABOUT 5 MINUTES, BECAUSE I HAVE TO PICK UP MY 14-YEAR-OLD AFTER TUTORING.>>OKAY. WE’LL UNDERSTAND, AND MARTY WILL BE–>>I’LL TRY TO KEEP MY AGENDA ITEM WITHIN 5 MINUTES.>>UNLESS SOMEONE ELSE IS WILLING TO VOLUNTEER FOR THAT.>>TO?>>PICK MY SON UP AT TUTORING.>>DON’T EVERYBODY JUMP AT ONCE.>>MARTY.>>YEP. THE LEGISLATURE IS ON ITS DEER HUNTING/HOLIDAY BREAK NOW. THEY ALLEGEDLY WILL BE COMING BACK FOR 3 WEEKS IN DECEMBER, ALTHOUGH THERE’S NO FACTUAL BASIS BEHIND THAT. IT SHOULD BE LESS. SO THERE ARE SOME BILLS THAT–>>THAT WAS FUNNY.>>THANK YOU FOR CATCHING THAT ONE, DAN. [ LAUGHTER ] THERE ARE SOME BILLS– BILLS THAT ARE STILL ON THE FLOOR OF BOTH THE HOUSE AND SENATE THAT COULD BE RUN DURING LAME DUCK. THERE’S A BILL TO REQUIRE AUTOMATIC RETENTION FOR 3rd GRADE READING, IF A STUDENT IS NOT READING AT GRADE LEVEL BY THE END OF 3rd GRADE. THERE’S ALSO A BILL TO REQUIRE OUR ACCOUNTABILITY TO GO FROM OUR SYSTEM NOW TO THE LETTER GRADES. THERE ARE FOUR BILLS DEALING WITH SOCIAL STUDIES ISSUES, LIKE OBSERVING FREEDOM WEEK, HISTORY INSTRUCTIONS, AND NOT BANNING THE TEACHING OF HISTORICAL DOCUMENTS. THOSE ARE IN THE SECOND HOUSE AND WILL PROBABLY MOVE. THERE’S NO OPPOSITION TO THOSE. AND THEN THERE’S ALSO THE BILL ON STATE REFORM DISTRICT TO PROVIDE OPTIONS. SO THOSE ARE THE BILLS THAT PEOPLE ARE TALKING ABOUT IN PLAY. SO WE WILL– WE HAVE A LEGISLATIVE COMMITTEE MEETING YESTERDAY WHERE THOSE WERE DISCUSSED. WE’RE KEEPING OUR EARS CLOSE TO THE GROUND IN THE LEGISLATURE TO SEE AND INFORM YOU OF ANY MOVEMENT ON THOSE WHEN THEY COME BACK INTO SESSION.>>DID ANY ACTION OR RECOMMENDED ACTIONS FROM THE LEGISLATIVE COMMITTEE EMERGE ON ANYTHING THAT’S CURRENT?>>NO, NOTHING CURRENT. THERE WAS A DISCUSSION THAT I THINK KATHY BROUGHT UP YESTERDAY ABOUT THE BOARD DEVELOPING A RECOMMENDATION ABOUT ITS CONSTITUTIONAL MANDATE ABOUT RECOMMENDATIONS TO THE LEGISLATURE REGARDING SCHOOL FUNDING. I THINK WE’LL BE WORKING ON THAT FOR NEXT MONTH.>>ALL SET?>>OKAY. GOOD. GOOD COMMITTEE MEETING YESTERDAY, AND GOOD REPORT, MARTY. YES, MA’AM.>>ONE OF THE PEOPLE WHO SPOKE TODAY MENTIONED THINGS THAT ARE BEING TALKED ABOUT MAY BE HAPPENING, ABOUT THE DETROIT PUBLIC SCHOOLS. THEY WOULD REQUIRE LEGISLATION, I THINK, THE THINGS THAT I’VE HEARD. AND I WONDER– IT SEEMS– WHEN WE TALK ABOUT THIS, THE STATE NEEDS TO PROVIDE LEADERSHIP HERE, MUST REALLY PROVIDE LEADERSHIP… [ INDISTINCT ] … WE HAVE NOT BEEN INVOLVED IN THOSE DISCUSSIONS, AND I THINK WE HAVE A ROLE TO PLAY THERE, IF WE ASSUMED IT, AND I THINK WE MIGHT WANT TO DO THAT. I THINK WE SHOULD.>>WHO WOULD YOU–>>DON’T KNOW EXACTLY WHAT’S GOING ON AND WHO’S TALKING TO WHO.>>WELL, SEVERAL OF US HAVE BEEN TALKING ABOUT IF THE GOVERNOR’S CHARGED– IS IT PATRICK? THIS NEW ORLEANS GUY TO DEVELOP SOME RECOMMENDATIONS TO HIM ABOUT THE FUTURE OF THE DETROIT URBAN FAMILY OF SCHOOLS– CHARTER, DPS, EAA. I DO THINK WE SHOULD BE INVOLVED IN THOSE DISCUSSIONS, AND ALSO IN THE DISCUSSION ABOUT WHAT COULD BE A GOOD VERSION OF THAT, IF ANY.>>THAT’S RIGHT, I THINK WE SHOULD BE INVOLVED IN THAT.>>SO I THINK I WILL ASK TO SEE–>>WE’RE SUPPOSED TO BE PROVIDING A LEADERSHIP AND GENERAL SUPERVISION OVER ALL PUBLIC EDUCATION.>>SO I THINK–>>CAN I MAKE A REALITY RECOMMENDATION? I HAVEN’T EVEN BEEN IN ON ANY OF THOSE. NOT SURE WHY. I THINK MAYBE A REQUEST TO CRAIG ABOUT SOME LEVEL OF INVOLVEMENT ALONG THE LINES OF WHAT YOU’RE DESCRIBING, AND SEE WHAT HIS RESPONSE MAY BE, BECAUSE I THINK IT’S A TOTALLY PROPER THING. IT IS IN THEIR HANDS, AND I THINK– YOU KNOW, AS I SAID, I HAD BEEN READING THE COMMENTS. I’M TRYING TO NOT ANYMORE, BUT THIS THING ABOUT ME KIND OF PLAYING BOTH SIDES OR WHATEVER AND ADMIT THE GOVERNOR– THIS IS PART OF WHAT– HE IS THE GOVERNOR. HE’S BEEN REELECTED. I HOPE HE WILL INVITE US TO BE PART OF THAT, BUT THAT’S HIS DISCRETION, AND HE CAN PROVIDE SOMETHING WITH OR WITHOUT US. I THINK JOHN, TO SAY THE LEAST, DID A GREAT JOB ON THIS FINANCE STUDY, AND I THINK THE DISCUSSION TODAY WAS HELPFUL TO SHOWING– PARTICULARLY YOUR REMARKS– TO SHOWING THAT WE WANT TO PLAY TOGETHER ON THIS. BECAUSE WE CAN ACT TOUGH, BUT IN THE FINAL ANALYSIS, IT’S THE HOUSE, THE SENATE, AND THE GOVERNOR. SO I’M A LITTLE DISAPPOINTED IN MYSELF, IN CASE I’VE MAYBE DONE SOME THINGS THAT HAD ME LESS INVOLVED THAN I FELT LIKE I WAS AT ONE TIME, BECAUSE I’D LIKE TO BE PART OF THOSE DISCUSSIONS, MYSELF. BUT I THINK A REQUEST THROUGH CRAIG THAT WE’D LIKE TO BE PART OF THAT IF THAT’S APPROPRIATE– I THINK WE CAN ADD VALUE, AND I THINK WE HAVE A ROLE.>>I’D HOPE SO– WE’RE IN CHARGE OF THE CONSTITUTION.>>IT’S MORE INAPPROPRIATE, BUT I’M JUST SAYING THEN THE REALITY PART IS THAT THEY CAN SAY NO. SO I THINK–>>BUT WE HAVE TO ASSERT OURSELVES, I THINK.>>WELL, THE WORST CASE WOULD BE– WORST CASE, IF THAT WASN’T ACCEPTED AS A– I THINK IT WOULD BE, FRANKLY, BUT IF IT WASN’T, WE’D SEE LAWS AND OTHER THINGS COME TO THE TABLE, AND WE’D EITHER QUICKLY REACT WITH A LEGISLATIVE COMMITTEE, OR WE’D TRY TO GIVE INPUT AT THAT POINT.>>THE THING IS WE ARE– EVEN TODAY, I TALKED TO CRAIG ABOUT THE BENEFITS ABOUT US BEING INVOLVED IN THOSE DISCUSSIONS AND WANTING TO BE CONSTRUCTIVELY INVOLVED TO FIGURE OUT WHAT’S A GOOD VERSION OF THAT, IF THERE’S SOME VERSION BEING COOKED UP OVER THERE. SO I’M ALREADY SAYING WE SHOULD OFFER TO ENGAGE.>>WE SHOULD.>>YEAH.>>CAN WE QUICKLY APPROVE THE CONSENT AGENDA AND COME BACK TO THIS AS COMMENTS?>>YEAH.>>OKAY.>>I MOVE THE CONSENT AGENDA.>>CONSENT AGENDA IS ONLY ONE THING.>>SUPPORT.>>BUT THE CONSENT AGENDA IS JUST ONE THING.>>THERE’S SO MUCH CONTROVERSIAL STUFF THAT HAD TO BE THROWN OUT OF THERE.>>MOVED BY DAN?>>MOVED BY JOHN, SUPPORTED BY EILEEN.>>MOVED BY JOHN, SUPPORTED BY EILEEN. ALL IN FAVOR, AYE.>>all: AYE.>>OPPOSED, SAME. AND THEN KATHLEEN, IF YOU’D LIKE TO CONTINUE.>>WELL, I’VE MADE MY POINT, I THINK. I JUST THINK THAT WE SHOULD BE TALKING ABOUT THIS. THIS IS A MAJOR PROBLEM IN THE STATE, AND IT’S A MAJOR ISSUE IN EDUCATION. WE QUOTE THE CONSTITUTION– ALL THESE PEOPLE QUOTE THE CONSTITUTION TO US, SO WHERE’S MR. LUCK TODAY?>>NOTHING’S HOLDING YOU BACK FROM TALKING ABOUT THAT.>>WE WILL. THANK YOU. IT’S GOOD YOU RAISED IT.>>WE HAVE AGENDA PLANNING. WE HAVE OTHER VEHICLES TO DECIDE WE’LL TALK ABOUT IT. I’M JUST SAYING ANOTHER POSSIBILITY TO CUT RIGHT TO THE CHASE WOULD BE A REQUEST OF CRAIG TO–>>THAT’S FAIR. I MEAN, SO I WILL ADMIT TO BEING A PROVOCATEUR AROUND A LOT OF THESE THINGS, RIGHT? I’LL ALSO ADMIT TO NOT SAYING NEARLY ENOUGH– I DON’T READ THE PAPER OR UPDATES AS OFTEN AS I SHOULD, AND SO, QUITE HONESTLY, I FEEL LIKE I’M A DAY OR TWO BEHIND IN TERMS OF WHAT THE MEDIA IS REPORTING ON ALL THIS STUFF. I ACTUALLY HEAR FROM YOU GUYS, PEOPLE GOING LIKE, “WHAT’S THIS I READ, DAN?” AND I’M LIKE, “I DON’T KNOW, TELL ME. “WHAT IS IT?” SO AS MUCH AS I PLAY THIS PROVOCATIVE ROLE, I FEEL ILL IN– I FEEL LIKE I ACTUALLY HAVE LESS INFORMATION HALF THE TIME AFTER PROVOKING THE CONVERSATION THAN I PROBABLY SHOULD. BUT YEAH, I THINK IT’S– I THINK WE NEED A PUBLIC CONVERSATION ABOUT THIS SUBJECT, AND I THINK THE STATE BOARD WOULD BE A HUGE ASSET IN MOVING FORWARD.>>LET’S PUT IT ON THE AGENDA. I MEAN, AS I SAID, THAT’S WHY WE HAVE AGENDA PLANNING, AND THESE SHOULD BE YOUR MEETINGS AS YOU SEE FIT, AND I THINK YOU’RE RIGHT. IT’S AN APPROPRIATE TOPIC. I DO THINK IF I WERE YOU, I’D DO BOTH. I’D GET ON THE AGENDA, BUT I’D ALSO REACH OUT, MAYBE THROUGH JOHN, BECAUSE–>>WOULD IT BE APPROPRIATE– WHO’S THIS PERSON, IS IT THE FORMER SUPERINTENDENT OF SCHOOLS IN LOUISIANA? IS THAT THE GUY YOU’RE TALKING ABOUT?>>WELL, WAS HE SUPERINTENDENT IN LOUISIANA, OR WAS HE–>>STATE SUP.>>SO HE CREATED OR APPOINTED THE TURNAROUND DISTRICT, RIGHT? SO HE’S BEEN IN MICHIGAN, AT THE BEHEST OF THE GOVERNOR’S OFFICE, INTERVIEWING AND TALKING TO PEOPLE ABOUT THE DETROIT GOVERNANCE AND RELATED SITUATION.>>YEAH, BUT WOULD HE REPORT BACK ON HIS FINDINGS TO US?>>WELL, HE IS HERE AS A–>>WOULD HE COMMENT ANYTHING?>>THAT’S WHAT WE SHOULD–>>BUT I THINK YOU’D BE BETTER SERVED TO HAVE CRAIG OR– AS HE SEES FIT, BECAUSE THE BALL’S NOT GOING TO GO ANYWHERE IF THEY’RE NOT ON BOARD. HE’S AT THEIR REQUEST, SO I MEAN, I DON’T– I HAVEN’T SEEN HIM– I SAW HIM ONCE IN THE VERY BEGINNING OF WHEN HE CAME HERE, AND I KNOW HE’S BEEN DOING INTERVIEWS WITH APPROPRIATE PEOPLE.>>I HAVEN’T TALKED TO HIM, BUT MANY OTHER PEOPLE HAVE.>>NOT YOU, JOHN?>>NO, HE HASN’T. HE’S TALKED TO–>>I TALKED TO HIM.>>DAN, HE’S TALKED TO PEOPLE AND MANY OTHERS, SO–>>YOU’VE TALKED TO HIM AS EXCELLENCE SCHOOLS DETROIT.>>YEAH.>>NOT AS STATE BOARD.>>RIGHT.>>BUT I WOULD SAY THIS, AND I DON’T KNOW FOR SURE, GIVEN I HAVEN’T BEEN INVOLVED IN THIS EITHER, BUT I DON’T THINK THERE’S A GRAND CONSPIRACY GOING ON. SO I THINK A REACHING OUT TO CRAIG MIGHT SOLVE THIS, AND THEN BY THE NEXT MEETING, IF NOT, THEN THE NEXT MEETING, THE BOARD STARTS TO DISCUSS WHAT THEY THINK THE PLAN SHOULD BE. I THINK THAT’S APPROPRIATE. IT’S JUST THAT THERE MAY BE AN INTERVENTION POINT RIGHT NOW WITH THE ELECTIONS DONE TO GET RIGHT INTO THE NITTY GRITTY OF IT, DIRECTLY WITH CRAIG AND WHOEVER HE THINKS– MAYBE IS PAST THE RISK ALSO. YES, SIR.>>DIFFERENT POINT? THIS ONE? I JUST WANTED TO HIGHLIGHT FOR FOLKS STEVEN McGHEE WAS THE PRINCIPAL AT CENTRAL WHO WAS PRESENTING WITH TWO OF HIS STUDENTS TODAY. THEY REFERENCED A GREEN COLOR CODING FROM EXCELLENCE SCHOOLS. I JUST WANT TO BE CLEAR WITH FOLKS A COUPLE OF THINGS. ONE, IT’S NOT THE STATE’S COLOR CODING SYSTEM. WE ACTUALLY, AS PART OF EXCELLENCE SCHOOLS DETROIT’S SCORECARD, WE GATHER THREE BUCKETS OF INFORMATION ON PROFICIENCY, GROWTH OR PROGRESS, AND CULTURE OR CLIMATE. THE CULTURE OR CLIMATE GRADE IS IN PART DRIVEN BY THE FIVE ESSENTIALS SURVEY THAT WAS DEVELOPED BY THE UNIVERSITY OF CHICAGO AS A SURVEY OF STUDENTS AND TEACHERS. AND WHEN YOU SCORE GREEN ON THREE OF THE FIVE DOMAINS THAT THAT SURVEY MEASURES, YOU’RE CONSIDERED WELL ORGANIZED, WHICH IS WHAT THEY SCORED. AND IT’S ACTUALLY BEEN PREDICTIVE OF FUTURE SCHOOL PERFORMANCE, WHICH IS ONE OF THE REASONS I THINK THAT GETTING TEACHER AND STUDENT VOICE INTO ACCOUNTABILITY SYSTEMS IS A GREAT THING. AND THE FIVE ESSENTIALS SURVEY HAS BEEN WELL RECEIVED AND HAS A LONG HISTORY BEHIND IT IN THIS REGARD. SO I GUESS A COUPLE OF THINGS. ONE IS A GENTLE NUDGE ON THE DEPARTMENT TO CONSIDER THE FIVE ESSENTIALS SURVEY AS A WAY OF INCORPORATING TEACHER AND STUDENT VOICE INTO A FUTURE ACCOUNTABILITY SYSTEM AND GATHERING USEFUL DATA.>>WE’LL TAKE THAT UP.>>IT’S WORTH EXPLORING, AND I THINK IT’S WORTHWHILE. SO I GUESS THAT’S PROBABLY THE–>>WELL, AND YOU KNOW IT COULDN’T BE OUR SYSTEM, BECAUSE WE USE LIME. [ LAUGHTER ] WE’RE NOT GOING TO LIKE A REAL COLOR. WE’RE GOING TO– CHARTREUSE. YES, SIR.>>ANOTHER ISSUE. I’D LIKE TO REPEAT MY REQUEST THAT WHEN WE DO THESE GRANT AWARDS, THAT WE PUT THE AMOUNT OF THE GRANT IN THE TITLE. THAT SAVES ME A LOT OF CLICKING WHEN I HAVE TO TRY TO FIND OUT WHAT’S– I MEAN, I’D LIKE TO LOOK AT THE MILLION-DOLLAR GRANTS AND SKIP OVER THE SMALLER ONES.>>OKAY.>>I KNOW IT’S SHALLOW, BUT–>>NO, NO, NOT AT ALL. I MISSED THAT.>>I PUT IT IN THE CRITERIA. I DIDN’T–>>OH, THANK YOU.>>I’LL FIX IT.>>THANK YOU.>>WE UNDERSTAND YOU NOW, ACTUALLY. YES, SIR.>>ARE THERE ANY OTHER COMMENTS?>>ANY OTHER COMMENTS?>>SO THE OTHER JOHN STEWART, IN ADDITION TO HIS VERY MOVING MESSAGE THAT HE GAVE US, HE LEFT A LAMINATED ARTICLE ABOUT A WONDERFUL MICHELLE ANDERSON, A LOCAL WAYNE-WESTLAND TEACHER WHO’S GOING TO NEW YORK TO RECEIVE A NATIONAL HISTORY TEACHER OF THE YEAR AWARD. SO IN HONOR OF MICHELLE– AND HE ASKED IF HE COULD BRING HER NEXT TIME, AND OF COURSE. YOU CAN BRING ANYBODY YOU WANT.>>AND THE HOSPICE STORY ON THE OTHER SIDE.>>YEAH. [ LAUGHTER ]>>TWO IN ONE.>>NOW, I THINK WE GOT INVITATIONS– ISN’T THERE AN AWARDS CEREMONY FOR US?>>OH, I DON’T KNOW.>>BY EMAIL.>>NOT THAT I’M AWARE OF.>>MAYBE NOT. MAYBE I MADE THAT UP.>>YOU MAYBE DID YOUR OWN. SERIOUSLY. ALL GOOD? GREAT. NICE, SHORT, SUCCINCT.

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