[479] The Master Lock Paradox – Model 410 LOTO Padlock

this is the lock-picking lawyer and what I have for you today is the most baffling product made by masterlock it's the model 410 lockout/tagout or lotto padlock now this is not designed to be a security device like most other path box what it's designed to do is to be attached to the control mechanism something like a a switch a power supply a valve of industrial machinery or equipment to ensure that it's not turned on while a worker is inside or in some sort of zone of danger so we get away with the plastic lock body we have a non hardened six millimeter shackle but the interesting part of these locks and what makes them so interesting is the core that's inside this actually has a relatively robust core it is a 6-pin core it has a relatively pair eccentric keyway it's one of the better ones that master lock makes and this is full of security pins now I can't take this core out without breaking the lock body but I do have another core that I've opened up for you so you can take a look at what's inside and you can see we have five spools and one lightly serrated pin so pretty good pinning on these and that makes them very good practice locks particularly with the with the pair eccentric key way it's probably my second favorite practice lock out there after the American lock model 1100 and I actually keep a carabiner full of these things for practicing I'll take one of these with me go to watch a movie and just pick them open while I'm sitting there on the couch so what we're going to do is pick this guy open I'll show you how I approach them and then I'm going to explain why this lock is the crux of the master lock paradox so let's get this open I usually use top of the key way tension with a bent 40,000 spry bar and I use my number seven hook in 18 thousands now all of these locks are pinned the exact same way with that lightly serrated pin in the number five slot so that's always what you're going to want to hit first you of course on the way back should probably check to make sure nothing else is binding so we have one loose too loose threes loose four actually four is binding a bit got a little click out of him five okay let's get him set we just dropped into a little bit of a false set let's go on to number six got I think I just over set six let me release some tension okay I think we got six set back to the beginning counter rotation on one got him set counter rotation on two got him set number three counter rotation come on number three there we go and got the lock open so I'm very used to picking these so I can get through them relatively quickly but don't be deceived they're actually pretty tricky locks to open up and I know a lot of people who have a fair amount of trouble with them now why is this lock the master lock paradox well the issue is that this has one of the best cores that master lock makes in one of the worst bodies that master lock makes and I'm not entirely sure why that might be now I know some of you are thinking right off the bat well it's a lot of lock you need a lot of different differs for the keys so that's why they put the 6 pin core in there but take this lock it's the master lock 6835 another lock that master lock makes for lockout tagout purposes it has a more secure aluminum lock body it has a hardened shackle as opposed to the non hardened shackle and it even has similar pinning in here with spools and one lightly serrated pin however this one only has five pins in it there's another lock that master lock sells for lockout tagout purposes and that is the number three and this one has only four pins and no security pins in it so it's not because this is a lotto lock that we have that that pretty good core in there because master lock does make other lotto locks with cores that are significantly less robust and now we can go straight through the master lock lineup we have for instance this is a model m5 it's one of their more beefy laminated steel padlocks and this one only has four pins and no security pins so a relatively robust exterior however the core is nowhere near as good as the core on this little plastic lock we can go up higher in the master lock lineup with the m15 this is a lock where they did almost everything right in building the lock body it's an extremely strong lock yet what we have for a core is a 5 pin core with no security pens so we have the lock body they did everything right on and nothing right in the core and then we have the lock body everything is done wrong on and everything right in the core and we can move on to some of masters higher-end stuff we have the 930 here and this also usually has some spools in it though I found a few that have standard pins in them and this again only a 5 pin lock then we get the hardened version of that the pro series model 6230 same thing all we get is a 5 pin lock even moving up to the m9 30 the magnum version again 5 pins we do have security pins in here but still nowhere near this 6 pin lock so that my friends is the crux of the master lock paradox how did we get such a good core in such a terrible lock and then at the same time put such terrible cores in locks that are relatively robust I'm sure I will go to my grave never understanding that so if you do have any questions or comments please put them below if you like this video and would like to see more like it please subscribe and as always have a nice day thank you

23 thoughts on “[479] The Master Lock Paradox – Model 410 LOTO Padlock”

  1. I cant definitively solve this paradox but ive got a good theory. Hi, LPL, I work in the plant industry. Ive worked at plants all over South TX and Louisiana. During an outage one med sized plant might buy several thousand locks like this and use every one. And this is THE lock they use. I found one for as little as 8 bucks while all others you showed in the same logo cstagory seem pricier which would explain the ubiquity of thit one.
    Plants have to lock out every immaganable part of hundreds of peices of equipment each with up to 100 loto locations. This takes days for a small army of operations personal to perform before it's safe for the first worker to start maintainancing this machinery. These locks end up staying on for weeks and months sometimes and because they are cheap, they degrade quickly. So they usually get used once and then tossed in the trash. There are usually locks and keys lying arround everywhere after a big outage. The locks are garbage but the brass keys last a lot longer. Not to mention that every contracter has to use thier own lock and key every time they work on a peice of locked out machinery in kind of a lock on a lock on a lock inception game. The lengths they go to are mind boggling. So you have a scenario where there are literally thousands of locks on one site with thousands of old keys floating around and you multiply that by all the sites just in one area and you have a potential for quite a few redundant pin configurations with even about 20,000 useful configurations on a 5 pin lock (so ive read). As crazy as these numbers are, it may not be acceptable to an industry where any one lock failure could cost so much. Adding one pin gives you 9 times more possibilities (I suspect). All that to say maybe the answer to your paradox is simply that the customers asked for 6 pins because they want THAT MANY unique key possibilities. Cant explain the fancy pins though.
    Hope this helped a little at least. Love the vids. Keep it up.

  2. I love it. "I have a carabiner full fo these" "I pick them while sitting on the couch watching a movie".

    Some people pick locks and some people knit. I wish I could do both(I only knit).

  3. Would it be because the better core allows more options for individual unique keys? If you work in an industrial setting where you’re using these, breaking LOTO intentionally or even by accident is cause for dismissal so RARELY do people break them by force (hence the weak body). Additionally the intention is so that no two locks have the same key. If I order a batch of these and they come with two keys I send the entire batch back or a key in one box opens the lock of a lock in a different box… I also send the entire batch back….and when looking for them you often need to clarify that you want all of the locks keyed differently. Just a thought.

  4. I actually know the answer to this!

    I work in a kitchen. If a malfunctioning piece of equipment is spotted, it’s the ‘spotters’ responsibility to use a lock like this to make sure it isn’t used. The ‘spotter’ is also responsible for holding the key until a repair can be made. However, if the spotter is not there on the day the repair supposed to be made, the lock needs to be cut so the work could be done.

    Thus, you need a lock that’s hard to tamper with in a way that leaves no evidence.

    For example, If I saw the deli slicer was broken, it’s my responsibility to lock it out. Other cooks wouldn’t be able to easily get around the lock (which they would try), and if they did, it would be obvious someone was ignoring safety protocol. If the repair guy came on my day off, he could simply cut the lock off

  5. The plastic body is safe in electrical panels, so when a worker touches the lock body to unlock it, they are not in danger of arc flashes.

  6. "I'm used to picking these so I can get through them relatively quickly" no shit LPL. this beginner is still struggling with it. But enjoying it. Thanks for sharing your knowledge with us.

  7. I think the point LPL is trying to get at is not why the LOTO lock had such a great core, but why the high end locks don't. That's more confusing.

  8. Ok, so I work in meat processing plant where we abide by lock out tag out and use the plastic body. They are really just meant as a deterrent and you could do the same thing with a piece of steel wire.

  9. I'm struggling to think of a situation where a malicious actor could get away with killing someone by picking LOTO locks.

    Your victim would have to be a lone contractor. The equipment would need to have relatively few lockout points, all of which were out of sight and not on security cameras, but be large enough that an accidental activation would reliably kill. After the murder, the lock would need to be replaced (making tampering totally obvious, since the machine operated), moved to a nearby piece of equipment to stimulate confusion (less obvious but would still arouse suspicion and be a topic of investigation), planted on the person (might not be suspicious if the tradesman is known to cut corners, but would be investigated), or thrown away completely (suspicious, but would prevent a forensic locksmith from confirming the lock was picked). You would need an alibi for bring in the area, or you would need to do the entire thing covertly after breaking into the facility.

  10. Because, safety is number one priority, Safety, not security. so in case you lost the keys, no problem to brake the lock. but in case of somebody trys to cheat without leaving trails, it would be hard.

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