🔴 Why rote learning SUCKS (Live stream)



hey what's up guys today I wanted to do a livestream and talk about why rote memorization sucks and why it's not useful and how it can be really beneficial to you if you start to expose yourself to the language before you try to memorize it all and this video was brought on in part based off of a scene that I saw in the Dead Poets Society which is a great movie from the year I was born I think I'm dating myself a little bit for those new younger youtubers but if you've never seen that the Dead Poets Society you have to watch it is this really a great movie and there's just this really brief scene in the movie where they're sitting in Latin class learning Latin and you might not even notice it or pay attention to it if you know you just watch it one time but for whatever reason this scene has always stuck out in my mind they're sitting in Latin class learning Latin and the teacher is kind of pacing back and forth across the front of the class and he has a bunch of like non declensions just written on the chalkboard behind them he's just pecs passing back and forth the front of the class saying Agricola Agricole lys Agricola Agricole Arun and the students are repeating after him after everything he says they just repeat it right back after he says it then he gets to the end of his long list I think these are all the different declensions all the different now in declensions for the word farmer I believe in Latin and they get to the end of the list and he says the last one and then he says again Agricola Agricola lys and he just goes through the whole list again and so that's their Latin class it's not particularly interesting and they probably didn't learn anything in this class then you fast forward just a little bit to the first day of English class with John Keating Robin Williams character and he walks into class whistling and he stands on top of the desk and he brings English poetry and literature to life for these students and he gives them a reason to remember it and our reason to actually enjoy learning English and so the contrast between these two teachers could not be more stark and of course that's really one of the main themes of the whole movie not just between the two teachers but between various learning styles that tried-and-true rote memorization of you know of our forefathers or the new radical learning methods of John Keating and the problem with this English with via with the Latin class in this movie and again it's just a very brief scene it's maybe 30 seconds long or 20 seconds long this professor just repeating words over and over and having them just repeat after him this long list of Mountain declensions and the problem is that all of these repetitions and all of this memorization means nothing if you don't have some context to frame it in so I'll give you an example of something that I've been going through over the past six weeks because i'm learning thai as most of you know i've been using a key to learn new vocabulary and tai excuse me and you know on key i I like it I'm he is a good resource for learning new vocabulary I think it's valuable but it presents the new vocabulary words in a more or less logical order which means that one day I started learning days of the week when I learned all seven days of the week and then I learned all 12 months of the year directly after that 19 vocabulary words thrown at you all at one right after the other all right with no context or you know no practice using that you get practice you the spaced repetition but you don't get to use them in context you don't get to use them you don't get to practice your pragmatics usage of these words and you know how hard it is to keep twelve months straight in your mind when you're just taught all of these words all at once and then you're just expected to remember them all is you know it's just here here's 12 months just memorize them all and don't mix them up in your head it's really hard especially when you add in all seven days of the week on top of that so the problem is I don't have much of a reason to use these words outside of when I'm using unki um and there's one main exception to this and that's the word July alright and the reason I use July this word when I'm speaking Thai conversations director : that's the Thai word for July the reason that I use this word is because I'm online chatting with people you know native speakers of Thai I try to find people that I can practice with online and I'm chatting with them and one of the main questions that always comes up early on in our conversations and Thai is when are you moving to Thailand so this is a word that was instantly useful to me because it was coming up in conversations okay so you know I learned that one word pretty quick it didn't take a whole long time like it did for learning September or December or Thursday because these words I was just learning by rote memorization I was using spaced repetition you know and like I said I'm not opposed to using a key I am using on cue so I think it's a good system but it has its limitations for sure especially when it just throws lists at you like this I'm not a fan of that not at all Hongki has unki memorized drops they have their strengths they have the read notices and in my opinion this is one of weaknesses okay Allen says unki it's amazing I use sometimes learning English and French yep like I said I'm not opposed to uh yeah I think it's a good system I like it it's useful it has its value but you also have to know its shortfalls too along with its value the human mind just has some ways that are more effective of learning things because if you can imagine sitting in that class in the Dead Poets Society just sitting there just listening to the professor say I agree police Agricola Agricole Adam you can imagine walking away from that class and forgetting all the information as soon as you're out of class so these are things that we have to be thinking about let's be cognizant of them I'll give you another example I was this one this one goes a little bit opposite opposite of what I'm talking about here same concept though so so learning vocabulary words it's so much easier to learn things that you already know learn things that you've already been exposed to then it is just trying to cram a whole bunch of new information into your cranium all at once okay um you can't always get away from memorization but the least you can do is find ways of making it easier on yourself and making it meaningful memorization okay so one of the main points I want to bring up is exposing yourself to the information exposing yourself to the language before you start just memorizing it alright so um there was a song that I was listening to in French when I first started learning French the song is by zazz zazz or was it turn the mermen name is Sonia – no look I'll think of the name of this song here just saying rocks should have looked it up before starting this live stream says servo that's the name of the sounds your vote alright and in the chorus of the song she keeps going through things that people you know could potentially give her she says give me the touch up the Eiffel Tower I don't want it give me all these big and expensive things I don't want them and I had a pretty basic level of French at the time that I was learning that I was listening to this song so I would hear people say I would hear her say should know the pot and I understood every word in the sentence and it made complete sense except for that little word oh and I just didn't understand why that word had to be in there I would have it would have made complete sense to me if she would have just said she knew the paw but instead she said you know the paw and I would listen to this song a lot and I just figured it was just one of those things where I just don't understand my new Shae of the grammar in the French language you know there's just little details that for whatever reason just have to be that way and I don't understand them all and I just kind of accepted that so for months and months in my probably a year I listened to the song and I was familiar with the words but I never quite understood until one day I was sitting in French class and we were going over French pronouns and my French teacher just mentioned that one pronoun in French that you don't normally think of as a pronoun is um and at that moment it just made complete sense to me cuz as in this song is not just saying I don't want she's saying I don't want it so this word that I used to think was just a preposition is now a pronoun and she's saying I don't want it she says offer me the Eiffel Tower I don't want it offer me I remembered the words a sweet that the Ritz I don't want it and all of this just came around and started making sense and I wouldn't have even noticed this it wouldn't have even been a memorable class to me if I hadn't already been aware of how this phrase was constructed in the song how people actually use this little word so it was my my previous exposure to the language that made this French class relevant and meaningful to me right because all of my other classmates who didn't know this song presumably were just sitting in class just listening to a regular just a regular French class a regular lesson that was no different from any other ones because they didn't have previous exposure the previous interaction with the language in this way that I did and I had just had this you know this light coming on moment where it was like all of these months where I was listening to this song and didn't quite understand why she was saying like that now it explains to me and now it all makes sense now all the pieces fit together and it took no effort to remember this this French lesson afterwards because I had already built up the foundation on which to do the learning okay if you have a context to learn with before you start doing the memorization before we start doing Bell learning before you start doing the rote learning it's gonna just be easy to go off of because you already have something to build off okay I'll give you another example um in Spanish and in French one of the first things people learn how to say is Jim m'appelle or McGill me llamo right me llamo Aaron my name is Jim Appel in these two is generally get translated as my name is when they're translated into English the problem is the phrase Jim m'appelle does not contain the word name and it does not contain the word is neither does the phrase the phrase may-yammo these two phrases the one in French and one in Spanish would be more accurately translated as I call myself literally okay but when you're in your first week of French class a phrase that's gonna be really useful for you to learn how to say is just my name is okay you don't need to be learning about reflexive pronouns and how they work in in how verb conjugations work in french you need to be learning how to say phrases like my name is so when you first start learning French they're gonna teach you that Jim m'appelle means my name is it goes very much it's the same thing in Spanish when you learn how to say megusta your first week in Spanish class they'll tell you that megusta means I like X when in fact it doesn't mean I liked X it means something will having the Lions of X pleases me okay but they don't tell you this stuff your first week in in Spanish class because it's just not relevant what's relevant is learning how to communicate with other people and then later on down the line they'll start teaching you these reflexive pronouns or these object pronouns and then you'll start to make sense of of how these little smaller words just month pail or you'll me llamo how these little words actually affects the meaning of the sentence and and you know who actually is the object and the subject of the verb and yo me me gusta X and all of that those fine little details would just get weight overbearing and way too confusing if they were just taught to you at the very beginning in your first week of class it's much more valuable to learn whole phrases it's much more valuable to learn to say things that you might actually want to communicate rather than just starting by just grinding away at your textbooks or just sitting there listening to the Spanish professor say may teh lay knows oh s— say you know these are just not useful things to do because you can say maintain they say Knossos say all day long but you're gonna walk out of class not remembering those things okay one thing you might remember how to say is megusta spaghetti right because you're probably have a mock conversation in class with one of your classmates and you might actually have a legitimate reason to use this word maybe gusta tacos right if you know someone to speak Spanish you can automatically go out and start using this phrase with someone in the real world whereas if you learn mate a lay-oh s' you're not gonna be able to use that in any way it's not useful information it's not relevant to you and there does come a point where you just won't be able to avoid having to memorize some stuff and that's what unki is great for you know textbooks Spanish class these are great resources for learning the fine details of a language but it's gonna be a lot easier on yourself if you build up a foundation and a base of exposure to the language and then you tried to start learning some of the things that you've already been exposed to it'll make a whole lot more sense in your brain if you do it that way rather than starting by trying to memorize all the little details and then forcing them to fit together in ways that you're not entirely sure how they go together because you haven't been exposed to them previously that's the wrong way to go about doing it and sometimes you have to make mistakes sometimes you just have to go about just blundering your way into the language just trying to force the language to work in any way that you can and then you'll slowly start to develop the the fine details of the grammar and the ways that people actually use the language in real life Ellen says one question when you start studying a new language do you normally start for grammar rules or do you try to learn grammar using a in conversation oh that's what I'm saying there's nothing wrong with grammar rules you should eventually learn the grammar rules but it's a lot more useful to learn phrases and learn things that you're actually going to use in real life in conversation rather than trying to master all the rules first the rules will start to come along if you learn how to communicate and there's nothing wrong with taking time to just sit down and study rules or just sit down and try to memorize once in a while but if you start with that you're gonna have an uphill battle trying to learn stuff that you're not familiar with yet and it's just all new material and it makes no Masson it makes no sense as opposed to starting off with some ability to communicate starting off with some basis of things that you're already familiar with things that you've already been exposed to and then learning rules that you can see reflected in the things that you already know so with that said live stream is at 20 minutes and I know I was a little bit late today starting so it's probably why we don't have many people in the chat here but thanks for those who did watch or for those who will be watching this later I'm going to be at mask the Esperanto convention this coming week so I don't know exactly what my livestream schedule is going to be like I'll still try to do a livestream or some kind of video while I'm there at nest maybe I'll make a video about masks and after that that'll be about a week and then I'll be back here again probably getting ready for my move to Thailand soon after that and so my schedule might be a little bit shaky it already has been a little bit shaky the last few weeks haven't been live-streaming quite every week or uploading the video every Monday but hopefully once I get settled into Thailand my video upload schedule will get a little bit more regular so Isaac OSes what do you think about antimony Tom heavily discourages outputs as you can completely fluent through only input yeah I think that's BS I don't know what like methods they use I'll check it out though thanks for sending me that alright well anyways with that said thanks for watching and I'll see you guys soon he said

3 thoughts on “🔴 Why rote learning SUCKS (Live stream)”

  1. I love your channel..As a future English and Latin teacher I have always loved the Dead Poets Society and I’m planning on using it in my classroom as well! Best wishes from Germany..

  2. I'm juggling Coptic, Persian and Turkish right now. I create my own memrise course fitted for myself and my studies.

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